From Transactional Copy to Transformational Content w/ Rita Richa


In this Episode, Benji sits down with Rita Richa, producer at Sweet Fish to break down the much-needed move away from transactional copy.

If you find your copy feeling stale, robotic, or just plain boring Rita provides the spice you need to find your voice and start producing transformational content. We discuss several strategies for better writing in this episode including the F.I.R.E acronym that we use here at Sweet Fish. To read the full blog about F.I.R.E, click here.

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Welcome in to be to be growth. I'm yourhost Benji Block today. We're joined by Rita Rita, she's a producer here atsweet fish rita thanks so much for joining us on B two B growth today.Thank you so much for having me, Benji, I'm very excited to be here. Absolutely,so we're about to jump in but Rita just give us like a 32nd, like I say atwitter length bio, what's a couple of really important things maybe don'tknow about you, A couple important things to know about me. I am a hugefan of podcasting and content. I have been working at sweet fish media as aproducer for just about two years. It will be now running at least 10 showsregarding view to be production and content and all of that. So coming herewith just the behind the scenes viewpoint of some of the podcasts thatyou all produce and and our or hope produce and because of that passion, Iam known around here as a little bit of a Disney nerd Disney clean you couldsay. So I do have my own personal podcast called Deputy Poppa Businessjust for fun and I guess that's the full rounded picture of who I am andwhat I do. Well, we're so glad to have you on the show. I love the Disneyfashion, it's great, you're on me to be growth, this is kind of what what ledme to ask for you to be on the show. Okay, so I'm scrolling through linkedinthe other day I come across this post that you shared and have to say Iimmediately feel the pain point that you were kind of discussing and drivingat and it's around how B. Two B brands right copy and how they kind ofinteract. So layout for us three to like what you see in the frustrationthat you were addressing in that post. Yeah. So what I'm seeing, especially assomeone who is producing the content for these episodes day today is thatwe're having great conversations regarding the topic and the core ofwhat needs to be discussed. But in relating to each other, the people orthe copy is not feeling very human, it feels very transactional and what we'relearning right now, it's sweet fish. A lot of is how based on J. A Kenzo'sphilosophy, he's the host of unthinkable is how to turn our contentfrom just transactional to transformational and that's somethinghe really emphasizes and in order to do that it has to be human. We can'ttransform or impact people if we're speaking to just the data points or thefacts of the conversation. So the pain point is okay, we're making greatcontent in regards to the topic. We're feeling like it's just a tad roboticthough. How do we make it more human? Yeah, you pointed out we need to stopbeing sales e scripted, robotic and just plain boring and I think no oneever wants to be any of those four things. Really right? But it's so easyto kind of start to fall into one of...

...those. Why do you think that is? Why doyou think that we so often can, can fall prey to being sales, the scriptedrobotic or just plain boring? I think first of all just a very much clarify,just plain boring because I don't want to be rude. It's just thinking aboutthe context of your audience and your listener though, how many podcasts orblogs or videos out there exist that are talking about the same exact thingthat you are talking about. So maybe the content is fun and new and fresh toyou and the way that you discuss it internally or with your immediate peers,but it's the same to someone who's consuming this kind of contentconsistently on the outside. So another aspect of why we want to bring in thathumanity and we'll get into that in just a second, is to make it uniquebecause when you are yourself, you are bringing in your voice in addition toyour brand's voice and either the product or service that you'reproviding, that kind of trifecta is what's going to be so unique andrelatable to people because you are you, there is no other person like you outthere and that those ideas and perspectives that you infuse into thatcontent are what's going to set it apart from the chose or whatever elsethat's out there and what I mean by that is usually in these conversationswere very good at explaining the problem that you are trying to solvewithin your world, like, as a marketer, you were always trying to solve theproblem whatever that may be in your space, but sometimes we forget torelate to that problem too, whoever ideal ideal buyers are, or just ourlisteners or consumers of that content, so trying to relay a story into whatyou're talking about is so important and you kind of sometimes have to findthe story, it's not always just going to be there right in front of you, like,especially if you're selling something like, I don't know, sas if you're inthe SAS space and there's a software and you know, you're creating pivottables and you're in tableau, I don't know, that's not what I'm a fan of whatI know of personally, but what I know is that any time you use any of thosethings in that space, there's always going to be a story because you'reworking with other people and that's the thing would be to be someone'shaving success because of what you're doing and finding that is so important.Exactly. So those customer success stories are easy wins for infusing thatinto your content, but doing it in a way that's not overly pompous, like wesold 3000, blah, blah, blah and last year because of our amazing, blah, blah,blah, like more so that it's just bringing it to like, okay, let me talkto my customer success team. Let me see if there was a situation that we wereable to really like solve or we impacted somebody in some way becauseof the service that we're providing.

And you can infuse that story into thecontent that you're creating. You know, what's interesting about that Teresa iswhen you think of success stories in the B two B space and I've seen this onlinked in quite a bit. People will share a graphic with a quote from acustomer and that's what they think a customer success stories, which that'sa great start. But if you imagine how you could take that content to the nextlevel by expanding on that quote or taking it beyond. Like there's such adifference between a testimonial and customer success story where you couldmake it longer and really go into detail so that people connectemotionally. Right. Right. And interactive to. That's the biggestthing. It's like, what we can't, we have done once before here at SweetFish is we ask for permission of the customer, are you comfortable going ona video or recording this message so that we can include it in our content,it doesn't have to exist separate from the content. I think that's where thosekind of stories don't really hit the mark. It's just something that's kindof thrown out there as a look at me. But it could be included into any kindof educational content that you have as a piece of that. So it's a part of thatfuller puzzle. And then another thing that's even more impactful, I thinkthen the success stories is the vulnerability, like showingtransparency and honesty in your content marketing, especially when itcomes to your failures or your mistakes, like the vulnerable real stuff iswhat's going to have a different kind of impact because everyone drones onabout their winds, but more rare is it to see the behind the scenes of howthey got there or the moments that maybe they didn't land that award ormeet that quota that quarter and what they did to fix it and how they fixedit and what they did to improve. That maybe lead to success later on movingforward because the more you open up as an individual, the more people see youas human and naturally will relate to that content and ultimately end up justrespecting you. You know, it's widely known in business that in order to landthose deals or make those connections, you have to your consumers, your idealbuyer or whoever it is, they have to know like and trust you, right? So atthe end of the day, if I'm a human, I naturally subconsciously, I want toknow how I can relate to your brand, but also to you as a person, I want toknow what makes your product or your service is worthy of my attention and Imay not be thinking all those things, but if I see a way that, you knowsomeone that's big and successful, I didn't do the thing that they thoughtthey were going to do, but they came back from it and the story behind that,I'm going to naturally relate to that and trust that that person isn'tproclaiming themselves the Almighty, all knowing perfect, but just anotherhuman in the space that I can relate to and maybe want to do business withlater down the line, the more I ingest...

...and consume that content and followthem. Hey, everybody Logan with sweet fish here. If you've been listening tothe show for a while, you know, we're big proponents of putting out originalorganic content on linkedin. But one thing that's always been a struggle fora team like ours is to easily track the reach of that linkedin content. That'swhy I was really excited when I heard about Shield the other day from aconnection on, you guessed it linked in since our team started using Shield.I've loved how it's led us easily track and analyze the performance of ourlinkedin content without having to manually log it ourselves. Itautomatically creates reports and generate some dashboards that areincredibly useful to see things like what contents been performing the bestand what days of the week are we getting the most engagement and aren'taverage views proposed. I'd highly suggest you guys check out this tool.If you're putting out content on linked in and if you're not, you should be.It's been a game changer for us. If you go to shield app dot Ai and check outthe 10 day free trial, you can even use our promo code B two B growth to get a25% discount again, that's shield app dot Ai. And that promo code is be thenumber two be growth all one word. All right, let's get back to the show. It'sfunny how, you know, B two B brands try to talk to B two B brands and that'show it becomes robotic because it's a business trying to talk to a businesswhen it's a person talking to a person, it changes the dynamic of theconversation and it lends itself better to conversation. And that's something Ireally liked that. We were talking about this offline, we're talking aboutthe conversational side where we need to be interacting once. Maybe it's astory, a story that's posted or whatever content we posted. Some of thebest content is actually going to happen right in the comment section,the conversations that happen as that content gets pushed out. Yeah, right.And to relate to that point even further on one of the posts that I havecreated on linkedin, I did have a wonderful comment from someone um hername is Lauren Garforth and she's kind of cool, I kinda want to be her friend,she has pink hair, and her tagline says, just a creative storyteller working ina treehouse, and that's a segment for another day. I want to know about thistreehouse, but either way she said that when she writes for the brand that sheworks for, she thinks about how she would explain that content to a friend,like she said, what I love about this approach is one some of my weirdest butbest writing comes out in this way into it's almost therapeutic for me, I'mgetting to be authentic in my writing and that's cathartic, and that addsanother layer of human. So yes, it's cool to be able to think like, okay,I've created this piece, whatever it is, is it relatable? Like this is the waythat I would express this to my friend, but if that's too far fetched, becauseI know I talked to my friends very...

...differently than I talked to mycolleagues in the business space. Picture your content as if you weresitting at a table at a networking event and you're turning around tosomeone at that space, you're all grouped by tables based on yourexpertise, your knowledge, and you're all very excited to be there and shareand collaborate on that knowledge is what I created tangible and easy enoughto relate to that person, that casual business networking, like, bondingsetting, and if it is then that's great because your content is going toencourage that natural interaction and engagement, which is so importantbecause that's the other aspect to this human content creation don't justcreate content to create content. We've all heard that before. You have toremember to interact and collaborate with the people who respond to thatcontent so that you can start to build the community and those humanfriendships that it takes to know, like and trust you and ultimately your brand.Yeah, I'm imagining like, your friend or your at this networking event,you're like pulling out graphs on your phone and you're like trying to showthem, you know, I mean like what we might typically imagine, like it justwouldn't work right because people's eyes would glaze over there. Like thisisn't the way that humans really interact, but we all get so obsessedwith like our graph that proves our point about our product. And so I thinkit's such a helpful question. It might not be the end all be all question, butit is a good filter to run something through. Is this a way that I wouldtalk to another person? Is this the way I would talk to a friend or someone inin my business space because that it makes it more relatable. Absolutely. Wealso have this acronym here around sweet fish that is extremely helpfulthat I wanted to bring us back to in this episode as we're talking aboutcontent creation because we want to make this as practical as possible foryou like when you leave and you have to go back to writing your copy. What arethe filters you run through? Here's an easy one. It's the fire acronym. We'vetalked about this maybe a couple times on the podcast in the past, but firestands for fun, informative, relevant and extensive. Have you used this rita?And how do you see this being extremely beneficial to our listeners? Yeah. So initially we have this idea ofsweet fish a while ago that we wanted to create fire content and at first itwas this cringing, millennial fluff of the sense of the term like fire contentand that's and that's just in and of itself an example of how we to breakdown. Well, what does that mean for our brand? Right in our space? So we use itin this is a checkpoint. Like you just said as a filter, like you can't justput out content and put it out without editing it. Everyone knows that youneed checkpoints and filters to make sure that it's going to perform the wayor reach people in the way that you...

...want. So it starts with fun. Right,relax people. We're not trying to solve world hunger or be rocket scientistshere with the topics that we're discussing just because you're talkingabout like your go to market strategies or cloud transformation and the techinfrastructure. It doesn't mean that it can't be witty and a little fun. Andwhat I mean by that is relax on your language, provide visual aids, providethose stories where a casual outfit. If you're in a video, like you don't haveto be so buttoned up, there's very small ways to do that. And here'ssomething else that's kind of a pet peeve for me when you share theseimages for the love of God, stop using stock photos of people that representthe people in your company or your brand. It was your people that is ifyou don't do anything in this episode, if you stop using images that representyour people and start using your people were going to relate to it more becausewe know it's real people see through stock images. People see through it. Iknow exactly the same. Five stock images and you marketers out there, weknow you're on pixels or up splash or whatever. Using the same five stockimages, like use your people don't be shy, be fun, have fun with it. You know,and I think another thing is the informative aspect, right? Soinformative. Yes. Have fun, throw on the bells and whistles, but at the endof the day you need to provide details in your content that has educationalvalue. Something that what we call at sea fish and actionable takeawaycontent that someone can implement that day and James are ceo at Sweet Fishsays this best. He says to him, actionable content is something thatyou can either start doing or stop doing that day. Like when you can takeit away and be like, oh she told me I need to stop using stock photos, maybeI should stop doing that right? So informative and the sense of likeprovide the details, give the value out in the education, but keep it conciseand to the point relevant relevant, we're in the are of the fire, myfavorite letter because it's in my name, this is the point that most B two Bmarketers really are find that doing. They have no issue with relevancybecause this is where we want to make sure the message is clear and conciseand what they would be searching for and the S. E. O. World of things, youknow, making sure that you have those tools and topics that are aligning withyour essay, Oh strategy or your search keywords and we don't need to go toomuch into that now. But it's still important as a part of your firechecklist in your content analysis to determine whether or not you'recreating the content that's going to hit the mark. And then lastly extensivein our father acronym, make sure you ask those hard or deep questions thatmaybe people are afraid to like and if...'re not able to in a podcast settingbecause you're just not doing that right now try to imagine what thosequestions might be and let your copy and content provide those answers foryou. So for example, like maybe this is going to be vague but covid really hardfor a lot of people as we know, and there was a lot of questions thatpeople were afraid to ask in that kind of content sense be that voice and thathuman element that's going to answer questions that relate to what you'redoing in your industry, things that are happening in the world. You know,that's another part of the relevancy here is you have to be able to read theroom online, like don't post content that is completely insensitive towhat's happening in the world, relate to it, provide the value, be extensivein it. And it's going to just really hit the mark and hot dang if you markeddown and filtered through this list and got everything you are for sure. Goingto create fun, informative, relevant and extensive content each time it willalways be fire and not just in the corny sense of the term rita for you,when you look at this list of these four, which one comes easiest to youand which one do you have to work the hardest to make sure that it is in yourcontent. Honestly, fun comes the easiest to me because I'm just someonethat is very creative and tries to like find the fun and things where I finddifficulty personally and other people might find difficulty is the extensiveaspect of us going in deeper than surface level and it takes a certainkind of expert, you whoever is listening in your space to be able toget to that level for your content. And when we talk about extensive, I thinkyou can go very niche, like that's okay, but when you're personable and yourniche, that's where it connects better. Otherwise, Absolutely, when we talkrobotic, I think that's where the robotic voice starts to come from isyou're kind of talking in a niche that only you know about and you're notrunning it through a more personable filter. So just something to bethinking about rita anything else. I know you talked as we wrap up here, yougave this challenge that we should be fresh, fun, unique and personable.Anything else you would say sort of on this as we start to wrap up justanother tip if all of this is overwhelming because it's a lot ofinformation, something that we didn't sweet fish with our fire acronym is wecreated a checklist. So on every piece of content that we created, we had ourwriters or anyone that collaborated on that content go through that checklistto see if it aligns and then at the beginning of that checklist, make sureyou have either your mission or your brand statement at the top because noneof these things will hit or create the impact that you wanted to if it's notgoing to speak to the heart of your brand. So if you're having difficultyin creating the fun content, throwing...

...on the bells and whistles, sit down andreflect what is the heart of my brand? What am I really trying to do? Go downdeeper and then use all of these tools to further that initiative or goal thatyou have with your brand. Here's what I'm taking away from my conversation.We read it today, work to focus on and develop stories. That is a good placeto start interact with and have as much conversation as possible in thecomments, have the back and forth. Ask yourself, how would I explain this to afriend or someone at a networking event And then finally, if you can runthrough this fire acronym, fun informative, relevant and extensive.It's going to take your content to the next level and we'll have a link in theshow notes so you can see more about that fire acronym as well. I'm surethere's listeners rita that are going to want to connect with you get intouch maybe follow you on linkedin. How can people best connect Yeah, Followingme on linkedin would be the best my name is Rita Risha. I have my fun sweetfish logo on everything, so you will not miss me with our brand colorsForster and if you want to message me or just chat at any time, I'm more thanhappy to connect with you. Thanks again for being on B two B growth and uh thatwas rita one of our producers here on sweet fish. We're always havinginsightful conversations here on B two B growth that helped fuel growth andinnovation. So never miss an episode. You can subscribe to the show on yourfavorite subscription service, connect with me on linkedin, Benji bach andkeep doing work that matters. We'll talk to you soon. Yeah. Gary V says it all the time andwe agree every company should think of themselves as a media company first,then whatever it is they actually do. If you know this is true, but your teamis already maxed out and you can't produce any more content in house. Wecan help, we produce podcasts for some of the most innovative BB brands in theworld and we also help them turn the content from the podcast and the blogposts, micro videos and slide decks that work really well on linkedin. Ifyou want to learn more, go to sweet fish media dot com slash launch oremail Logan at sweet fish media dot com.

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