Organic vs. Paid: Which Is Better for Your Demand Gen Strategy?

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode, Lesley Crews talks with Breezy Beaumont, head of growth at Correlated.

The two discuss:

  • Paid vs organic advertising
  • Product-led growth
  • Demand gen vs. generating demand
  • How ABM and demand gen work in tandem

Yeah. All right, welcome back to BBB Growth. My name is Leslie Cruise with sweet fish media. If you're new here, welcome. We are currently approaching the end of our deep dive into demand generation. I can't believe april has flown by so fast. Um for the past month we've been specifically focusing on the topic of demand generation and kind of going back to the basics, you know, how do we define demand generation? What is trending in this industry and further, where is it headed in the future? So had a lot of really great conversations lately and today I am very excited to introduce breezy Beaumont head of growth over at correlated breezy. Thanks so much for coming onto the show. Awesome. Thanks for having me Leslie. Absolutely. So let's just dive. Right in the first question I love to ask during the steve dive because everyone has a completely different answer is how do you, in your own words define demand generation? Yeah, I think over the years the definition of demand generation has shifted from what I think it was originally intended. So if we, if we sort of break down the two words demand generation, really the goal should be generating a demand for your product in a market. Um, and I think that demand gen instead has sort of become this idea that it's a team who will generate leads for you and, and it becomes this large numbers game when really at the end of the day, we should be focusing on generating that demand. Absolutely. And when I think of demand in personally, I always think of, okay, so demand gen you're driving demand, It's pretty obvious, right? But, you know, in this situation you're saying that's not always the case. Can you dive a little more on, you know, demand jin versus actually generating the demand. How did these two kind of differ? Yeah, so I think sometimes we get so stuck in all of these numbers that companies focus a lot of their efforts on things like paid strategies where were easily able to see, okay, how many impressions and clicks and click throughs and conversions and how...

...did that move through our pipeline? And we love it because we can see all the data and I'm here for that. Right? It's awesome when we can see the data and we're seeing what converts. But at the same time if we're just focusing on those parts where we can measure, we're missing out on so many of the other parts that really generate a demand for your product, things like building a community and getting out on social platforms and talking with people or interacting with your customers or prospects. Even if you're on the marketing team, you should absolutely be doing those things. So I think if we Just think about the numbers behind everything, we miss those other opportunities to generate a larger demand. 100%. Yeah, that's good. And I know a big struggle and a lot of organizations especially here lately as this is kind of a trending thing is deciding in a way between A. B. M. Strategies or traditional demand generation. And how do you think that organizations should really be balancing the two? And is it possible for these two to work in tandem or are they two completely separate identities? Yeah. It is such a trend that everyone loves A B. M. Um and and no offense to my friends in the market or who are those A B. M. Marketers? It's not that I don't think A B. M. Is important or effective. In fact it is highly effective. But the problem is that so many companies are trying to implement an A B. M. Strategy when it's really not a fit for them. So, first of all, unless you have, if you're if you can only go after, you know, 100 insurance companies and that's it, no one else could possibly use your product then. Okay, fine. That's that's maybe a place where, you know, a B. M is going to be a good strategy for you. Also for anyone listening who maybe doesn't know a BM yet account based marketing. So it's that 121 or one if you want to many approach to marketing, um two different accounts. But so if that's...

...the case and you can only go after the small subset of accounts, it makes sense. Otherwise, people should most definitely be either implementing a hybrid model of demand generation and a B. M, or just simply demand generation. And so what I kind of picture that as is for most companies, it's gonna be that hybrid. So you're gonna do your general demand generation that's going to be across all accounts and sort of talking about the value and the benefits. And then on top of that, I see A B M is basically this layer on top of demand generation, where then you're getting really more specific about how you can help companies in a certain industry or with a certain use case or at a certain company or even a subset of a company. Maybe it's just 11 silo department within a company. And so it's just getting more specific with your demand generation strategy. But for companies who are strictly moving to this a B. M. Model when maybe they're a startup and they're not exactly sure who their true target market even is yet. It's definitely concerning from, from my point of view. Perfect. And how do you measure success in a demand gen strategy? Yes. I think there's a number of ways you can be measuring this and that's across both your paid and organic strategy. So, you know, if you're thinking of focusing on maybe running a podcast or putting organic posts out on social platforms like linkedin or or getting into conversations on cora you can take different metrics from each of those platforms, you know, the number of streams or the number of likes or comments on a post. Um and also following up with those folks who do interact with you if, if you know them on a on a person basis and then asking them, you know, is this something that you're interested in? Can we help you or or can we at least get feedback on our product and then, you know, taking...

...that type of data and getting it into your Crm as well so that you can be tracking some parts of this process. Of course on the paid side, I think, you know, there's all the different metrics of impressions and clicks and click throughs and all those pieces, but really across either a page strategy or an organic strategy or a hybrid of the two at the end of the day, what we should really be looking for is revenue. So what is the impact on our revenue? And are we seeing that go up? And I think a great example of that is when companies do guerilla marketing tactics, like they put their sticker on two bottles of beer at a conference or they gone ran a Super Bowl commercial. There's no, it's not going to be a perfect match of how you're going to see the impact of these, but there will be downstream impacts of it. And, and being able to look at, you know, number of demo requests following that activity or even if you can see revenue a little bit more quickly looking at the revenue impacts of those events. Yeah. And I think it's really interesting because a lot of people, someone that I talked to today was, you know, completely was talking about how organic is the only thing now, like we don't touch on paid media anymore and no one really utilizes paid media. And I kind of think that's that's a mistake because it's like, I mean if you could do paid media and organic, there's no harm in that, right. You're doing both. You're kind of getting that cross posting. Their, what I think so interesting about organic is it is difficult to measure, you know, it is difficult because it's like word of mouth marketing. I mean obviously on linkedin, like our company for example, we've been, our producer team has all been on linkedin lately, not because we have to be just because we all want to be, we all want to be talking about what we're doing, what we're learning in our roles and you know, we're connecting with a bunch of people, whether it's from our customers specifically and their team or beyond and it's getting a lot of reach, but those kind of things are hard to measure. So I think like you said, focusing on that revenue is really important. Yeah, absolutely. I mean there are some, there's you know,...

...shield app and some other ways that you can get some of those metrics around those activities. Um but at the same time, exactly, you're 100 spot on right. It is really difficult to measure the impact and the downstream impact of those types of activities. Um, and so that's kind of where it comes in words crucial to have that buy in at the top, you know, from your executive level team that understands how this type of marketing works, that not everything will measure what we can, but what we can't is still important. And, and we'll try to show as best we can that those other efforts are working things like word of mouth and referrals. We all know that that's the most likely to convert in your pipeline is anyone who came in from, from a referral or from word of mouth. But at the same time it's really hard to track those things. Um, so having that buy in from the executive team who understands that those activities are still really important is unfortunately one of the, the big parts of being successful there. Hey, everybody Logan with sweet fish here. If you've been listening to the show for a while, you know, we're big proponents of putting out original organic content on linked in. But one thing that's always been a struggle for a team like ours is to easily track the reach of that linked in content. That's why I was really excited when I heard about Shield the other day from a connection on, you guessed it linked in since our team started using Shield. I've loved how it's led us easily track and analyze the performance of Arlington content without having to manually log it ourselves. It automatically creates reports and generate some dashboards that are incredibly useful to see things like what contents been performing the best and what days of the week are we getting the most engagement and our average views per post. I highly suggest you guys check out this tool if you're putting out content on linked in and if you're not, you should be, it's been a game changer for us. If you go...

...to shield app dot Ai and check out the 10 day free trial, you can even use our promo code B two B growth to get a 25% discount. Again, that's shield app dot Ai and that promo code is B the number to the growth. All one word. All right, let's get back to the show. Let's shift gears a little bit and talk about product led growth. Um, you and I kind of discuss this off the record previously, but I'm really interested in learning more about product led growth and kind of what it is and where does demand gen fit in. So what does demand gen look like in a more product lead organization? Yeah. So that correlated. What we do is we help product led growth or other SAAS companies get product data into the hands of their sales and customer success teams. And so what that looks like is understanding, you know, when are people ready for Upsell or expansion or what accounts look like they might turn and so by looking at these different parts of the data where we're able to help these product led growth companies um be more successful. So product led growth is sort of a new return that I don't think a lot of people are super familiar with quite yet, but we use these products on a daily basis. These products led growth companies products, so things like zoom and Callen Dllee and Dropbox and expense if I um All household names at this point, especially with the pandemic. Got everyone playing scrabble with their grandmothers on zoom. Um But demand jin at a product like growth company is definitely different because these companies have a a self service model, people are able to get their hands on the product very quickly and very early, so you still have a lot of the same pieces of the demand gen...

...strategy um for for really any any other software product company. But at the same time there is an increase in these roles around um customer success and growth um at the product led growth companies. So what that looks like is since the demand gen team is getting people inside of the product, one of the crucial pieces is Vier al Itty and network effects, right? So when you put something into a dropbox and you want to share it with your friend, you send it over and they need to create a dropbox account to be able to accept it. So that's that idea of network effects in virology. And so that's kind of where it's like demanding on steroids. Is this this new growth idea that's that's inside of these P. L. G. Companies? Absolutely. So you wouldn't say that in a way that product led growth is creating a demand jin reduction or would you, I do think to some extent that we will see titles that are more around demand jin going down. And I think that's actually just more of a misunderstanding of what demand gen is. So I think the misunderstanding is that demand gen is at that first part of the sales funnel, right? So getting those people in L. A. And then we'll just toss it over the fence to sales. Whereas sometimes growth titles have a little bit more of an understanding that it's going to be through that customer lifecycle. So bringing in the lead. Yes, but also converting them and making sure that they're successful throughout the process. So I think simply for the lack of understanding of what the, the demand gen really is growth, but growth gets to the point a little bit faster. So I think we will see a little bit of a dip in the number of demand generals, but at the same time we'll see an increase in the number of growth rolls over time. And so I think those two...

...will will sort of even each other out. That makes sense. And I think like you mentioned the customer experience role is so crucial to growth as well because this is something that's evolving like demand gen is evolving over time and customer experience is such a crucial part of that. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean these types of companies that are giving their product away for free, if if the experience doesn't go well, then then you lose the opportunity to have that customer. But on the flip side of that, if the experience goes well and I enjoy using zoom with my friends and family, then when someone at my company says, hey, you know, we need a video conferencing software watching we use like, well I'm familiar with zoom, let's adopt it here. And so the downside is there, if the experience doesn't go well, but the potential upside is, is exponential. Absolutely. So if a start up or you know, maybe a scale up wants to implement a demand in strategy kind of from scratch, what tools or advice would you share with them? Maybe to someone who's new marketing or maybe to someone who's, you know, kind of running a business by themselves or with very limited, you know, staff essentially. Yeah, I talked to a lot of start up to sometimes it's literally just the two founders or our early stage companies. And my biggest advice is always first just make sure you've cleaned up what that process looks like from when someone comes in as a lead to turning them into a customer. So if you already have a good list of prospects and you're not able to convert them into a customer, then first we need to clean up that side of the process before we even think about doing demand generation to even further build up the front side of that bucket. And so first of all, just take a look at that process. You know, do you have on boarding emails to people, understand how to use your product?...

They know how to get started. Are you able to move people through those types of conversation? And if the answer is yes or or good enough for today, then fine. Let's, let's think about how we can start to build that demands an engine from scratch. And the way that I think is most effective to do this is to find your prospects where they are. So if you know you're going after marketing or sales folks, we know a lot of those types of people are on linkedin. Um, there's also great slack communities for pretty much any topic you can think of. So joining some of those black communities and seeing how people are talking about the types of problems that your product solves and starting to get into those conversations. Um, and then maybe if you're, you know, targeting more of an engineering type or others, you might find them on Cora or read it or or other websites like that. So I think first things first is just finding your prospects where they are and engaging in the way that they want to engage. Yeah, I think that's really important because I think a lot of times people will go straight to linked in and it's like, oh, why aren't these, you know, engineers are these tech people, why aren't they on linked in? And it's like, well that's not, that's not their place, you know, so it's like finding them where they are, I think is so crucial. That's really, really great advice. Yeah, absolutely. And it can totally shape your messaging as well. I mean, they're sitting there having candid conversations about the different types of problems that they're facing. This is like a gold mine of information for you to be able to sit there and listen and understand what keeps them up at night. And what are their biggest struggles or what are their investors pressuring them about? Um, what are their initiatives for this quarter? And if there are ways that your product fits in with with what they're hoping to achieve, then you know, that's the holy Grail. That's what we're hoping for. Perfect. Well, fantastic breezy. This has been really insightful for me personally and I know our listeners as well. Thanks so much for sharing your knowledge. Where can listeners find you...

...if they're interested in learning more from you or correlated? Yeah. So you can find correlated Atget correlated dot com. But you can also just find me on linkedin. I'm always happy to answer questions and chat with people there. So either works for me. Amazing breezy. Thank you so much again for joining me here on GDP Growth, awesome. Thanks Leslie Talk soon at Sweet Fish. We're on a mission to create the most helpful content on the internet for every job function and industry on the planet for the B two B marketing industry. This show is how we're executing on that mission. If you know a marketing leader, that would be an awesome guest For this podcast. Shoot me a text message. Don't call me because I don't answer unknown numbers, but text me at 4074 and I know 3, 3-8. Just shoot me their name. Maybe a link to their linkedin profile and I'd love to check them out to see if we can get them on the show. Excite.

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