B2B Growth: Your Daily B2B Marketing Podcast
B2B Growth: Your Daily B2B Marketing Podcast

Episode 2047 · 4 months ago

How to Make the Case for a Podcast to Leadership

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Join us on today's episode as we dive into our very first B2B Podcasting Q&A. 

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Yeah, All right, Welcome everyone. This isour first of what we're going to start doing a weekly BtB podcasting Q and ainspired by chris walker state of demand jin. We've got some questionsthat have come in from that email that I sent this morning and so we'll juststart diving in and answering some of those Logan. Do you want to kick it offwhile I'm letting more people in the waiting room? But since we only have 30minutes, I want to go ahead and jump in. Do you want to kick it off with thefirst question and then uh, and then we can, we can get from there. Yeah,absolutely. So thanks everybody that's already hopped on. And just for somecontext, if you have a follow up question or you have a question, youweren't able to submit before this call, James dan and myself will be keeping aneye on the chat so you feel free to pop those in and then we'll be kind oflooking through those prioritizing. We might call on you to hey, if you wantto add some context to this question or just read the question out. This firstone that we had was, how can I make the case to leadership at my company that apodcast is going to be successful and how should we, how should we gaugesuccess dan. Recorded a video on this that has been super helpful recently. Ithink that there are, there are two ways that I'm consistently advising ourcustomers on this front. One that your podcast is a double edged sword. Uh, itis not just about the reach, but because a podcast is generally aninterview based format, you need guests. And if a good portion of those guestsor people who fit your buyer persona, they're not just the people that yourbuyers want to hear from. You can build relationships with those guests thatmap to revenue. So think you're a B. M. Play mixed with your content place. Sokeeping an eye on how many guests relationships are turning into revenue.Either from those folks buying from you...

...or those folks referring their friendsor those folks sharing that content and then one of their peers then thencoming inbound as well as the reach. Now on the reach side, we don't have aton of information with podcasting, right? You don't get the emailaddresses, You don't get the granular information that you do with, say awebinar or something like that because it is undated, top of funnel content.But one thing I've been encouraging a lot of the marketing leaders we workwith to share with their executive teams is on average, people tend tolisten to most of every podcast episode that they listen to. And granular early.If you have a podcast You can go into your analytics and apple and look atwhat is the play through rate and apple will actually total it up. So you'regetting 200 downloads of an episode and your average play through rate is 80and the episode length is about 30 minutes. All of a sudden comparing thattotal time consumed, which you get into hours and hours very quickly with thatmath and won't try and do any math live but comparing that to the time spentwith your content in other channels. So not just impressions but totalconsumption that can put the podcast Really stack it up against your otherchannels and your other efforts to really compare apples to apples versusyeah 5000 views of this tweet and 200 downloads of this podcast episode. Thesmaller number might actually be having a bigger impact with that. I'll turn itover to Dan. Anything you would add to that man. Only in tracking attribution,you can usually find the podcast can be influential when you're actually askingcustomers, Oh, how did you find us? And what was this journey like for you?Like if you're asking customers when they first sign on with you, what wastheir journey like? That's where you can start to look for the podcast andhow I prove the podcast is helpful and relevant. It's not usually coming up onfirst touch attribution reports, right? Hubspot isn't can't see it. Uh if thereis anything like hubspot can't see it at all. Unless you have maybe like asome kind of special you are all you're...

...sending podcast listeners too. So whereit does come up is when you actually talk to them and actually kind ofbreaking down their journeys and that's where I like to prove that the podcastis a major part of that journey only because consumption of podcast is sodeep. Like Logan said, if you compare apples to apples, blog to podcast, 30minutes consumed on a podcast is a lot different than three minutes read on ablog post, it's 10 x. The amount of consumption which is much deeper. Andwhen I'm thinking about the success of my content marketing, I'm usuallylooking at consumption metrics like that. So I don't look, I try to compareit per minutes consumed when I'm trying to compare it to like linkedin or blogs.When I'm trying to compare apples to apples with other content marketingchannels, Shannon just dropped a comment here in the chat. She said ifyou put podcast episodes on landing pages, you can use engagement with thecontent as well. I don't want to put you on the spot, Shannon, but if youwant to elaborate there, but I know we talked about this in our growth group,I think it was earlier this week or late last week. Do you want to expandon that at all? Yeah. Hi everybody, there's a lot of people here. Good jobguys. Yeah. So we've actually cut down our publishing cadence and actuallyspent more time on really high value episodes that are targeted at ourlanding spots for our business. And what we've been able to do is when wehave a great expert that really aligns very well to a persona or to a landingspot, we find a place on one of our key pillar pages to place that episode,usually a video link. So either embed of Wisteria, I think is what we'reusing and were able to track engagement with that content. So whether if it'sproduced significantly more engagement than the page historically getting, butwe're using it as definitely like our demand team is using a lot more than Iever originally anticipated when we launched the podcast. So yeah, it'sbeen really cool and super repurpose able. I know someone said that to sosmall snippets, we can put that in the carousel were starting to think of itas like the more time we spend on each episode, thinking of it as more likepillar content unless like blog content...

...and it's proven pretty successful.That's for awesome, Shannon, thanks for sharing that. Our next question we gotfrom Peter Murphy Lewis, I think I saw him jump on earlier actually, um but heemailed this in before we started one of his questions and we get this a lot.He's the best practices for sharing and distributing like private facebookgroups, niche communities, Harrow, we've created a lot of content aroundthis and dan is actually our director of audience growth so he lives andbreathes this stuff, dan. Do you want to take the first stab at the answer tothis one? Yeah, I mean in A B two B play, like Lincoln becomes the bestdiscovery platform for podcasting. I can make a case for other socialnetworks. Probably twitter would be my next favorite. But if you're doing Btwo B Lincoln's where it's at, like Lincoln as if you've been listening toGary V, like he's been talking about how linkedin is a lot, like howfacebook used to be back in 2012, right? There's just an unfair advantage injust the organic content. How far it can go? So sharing and splintering yourpodcast content on the linked in and putting the link specifically in thecomments and not in the post itself is probably the single best way to gettraction for a b two B podcast right now. Beyond that, I almost like tothink of having like a main Discovery channel, like linkedin and then havingall my secondary ones, which I kind of just automate, unless I'm just gonnaput a lot of effort into it, I'd probably put it in your, like, your,your hoot suite, your hubspot social, your buffers and just kind of like buffthem all out. Normally those are channels are not putting a lot ofeffort into, but I'm essentially syndicating there and that's how Itreat most other social channels. Unless I wanted to put the effort intogoing all in which for us is linked in maybe someday, twitter. MichaelHartmann here had a question of audio only or video as you're breaking upyour podcast into those micro pieces of content and this is something robcommon on our team and a few other team members on our internal slack. We'reasking about this because we had a similar customer question. We see a lotof, a lot of things out there with what we call those audio grams. Right? Yougo to click on, it looks like a video...

...and it might have a moving wave form orit might have subtitles come up and my take on that is it's better thannothing. If you're doing that, you're posting something to drive people backto your podcast is definitely better than nothing. So I won't say you justdon't do that. Complete waste of time. But if you can develop a process forcreating micro video clips where the guest or the host face is nice andlarge. I saw SAm gave a thumbs up to video over audio here. Sam Moss, if youlook at his linkedin feed, I see his videos in my feet very consistently.Those micro video clips just consistently perform better than audioonly. And so some people might say, well, Logan you guys are a podcastagency. You're saying audio only isn't isn't the best, shouldn't you? You know,just always be saying that. But it's about the context, right? When you'rescrolling linked in or instagram for that matter, you're looking forsomething to actively engage with. And part of the reason why audio only ispowerful is in those times where you're looking to passively consume walkingthe dog doing the dishes where you're listening to audio only. And so videofits that context in that mode of consumption that your potential buyersare in when they're on social and so that's part of the reason. Plus justseeing from a lot of our customers that say micro video clips, whether we'reproducing them or they're doing them themselves are one of the topperforming social media assets, not just out of their podcast content, butacross all of their social content. So that's why we're big proponents ofrecording audio and video at the same time and then using them strategicallywhen you're going to go audio only and when you're going, yeah, riversidebeing a great platform, we're obviously doing this on zoom, but riverside is agreat platform that lets you capture higher quality video. So those videosend up looking better. The others were also building, we're in the midst ofbuilding a product right now that does automatic clipping for micro videos soyou can, you'll be able to, it should launch in mid May. I was just talkingto the development team right before we...

...jumped on here, but we're so passionateabout this, We're building an entire tool that allows you to upload yourvideo podcast interview and then if it's a 30 minute interview, it's goingto spit out, hey here, eight potential clips that you could use. And so aswe're getting closer and closer to it will obviously be talking about thatmore. But super passionate about video Ryan had a Ryan. Lanigan had a greatquestion. He said, I assume ranking in Apple charts helps with new listenersas well as linkedin content snippets. What does Apple look at when they'redeciding who to put into the top 10 download subs question mark. So I havefound right, and we don't have any, unfortunately we don't have any InsideInsider knowledge at Apple. I wish we had a relationship there. So if anybodyon this call knows somebody at Apple that they can connect us to, I wouldlove to connect with them. But from what I've heard and what I've justheard, other people talk about it, the quality of your cover art. So Appledoes care about the quality of your cover art. They obviously care aboutthe number of downloads that your show is getting. And I've heard that theyalso care a lot about how many subscribers your show has. So one ofthe things that we do whenever we're first launching shows is we try tooptimize around getting ratings on the show. And we obviously make sure thatthe cover art is good because we're producing it for them. So we have adesign team that cares deeply about that. So Cover Arts Good. And when weare equipping our customers with the language, the emails to use internallyslack messages to use internally to get your entire team to leave a rating ofthe show. We also have them get everybody to subscribe to the show aswell. So when you're asking for ratings of getting those early ratings, makesure folks are subscribing to the podcast as well. So yeah, so ratingsare a big one. I think reviews. I hear a lot of people talking about reviews,but I think ratings, I don't know this for sure. Again, I wish we had aconnection at Apple that could verify this. But because Apple only displaysthe number of ratings, it makes me...

...think that ratings matter more to themthan reviews, which is great for creators because reviews are a heck ofa lot harder to get than just getting somebody to tap the number of starsthey think the show deserves. That language that I just said actually isreally good language to use whenever you're asking for these ratings. And soI would say like, hey, we just launched this new show, would love for you tocheck it out and ratings are hugely helpful. Just have the number of starsthat you think the show deserves and that would really help us out a lotthat way. You're not telling people like, you know, leave us five starreviews. But obviously I would imagine everybody that you're reaching out toabout the show, there's probably going to want to give you a five star rating.So anything I missed there, dan Logan, I would just say that there's reallythree different ways you're gonna ranked an apple. It's in the new andnoteworthy, the category charts and in the search engine. Like if people aresearching for the key words that you want to get found for the easiest oneis the search engine and that you can just launch out the gate with, if youhave just pretty good cover art, which increases the click through rate ifyou're coming up fast and you just sneak the keywords into the title,which is like old school S. E. O. And just get a bunch of people to rate itreally quickly. Like you're gonna play most niches. It's the competition justisn't that hard. If you just start publishing in a new niche, your Garbagonna rank within the top one or three really quickly. The categories aredifficult but I'm, I swear it's gonna be more based on downloads thananything else. That's what I think James of course all the other thingsmatter. But the hardest one is just getting a brawl like a ton of downloads,new and noteworthy. Gosh, I wish I knew. I'm still figuring that out. There'slots of, there's lots of blog posts that shade these seven steps and I'vetried all those steps multiple times. Many customers. I'm like, nah, I don'tknow. I've heard of people saying they know, but they also have relationshipswith Apple and Apple, like literally won't talk to me. They're like so tightlipped. But I'm like, I don't, I don't think I hear a lot of new podcasterstalking about trying to get into new...

...and noteworthy. I personally never lookat new and noteworthy myself. So as a, as a podcast consumer, that's not how Ifind shows. Quite honestly. I don't find new shows by searching categorieseither. I could be an anomaly there. but I would be curious like if you havea thought here and you like how you find shows, um just drop it in thecomments would be really interesting for us to know like when you're inApple podcast or Spotify, how are you finding shows or you, are you typing ina keyword of a type of show you're looking for? Are you searchingcategories? Are you searching No. And new and noteworthy that way. I can Ican answer this question next time with more data than just my own personalpreference of how I consume. But going back to ranking for a keyword. So manypeople want to name, they want to get cute and fancy whenever they name theirshow and they want to name it after one of their core values or they want toname it after something that, that the outside world has no idea what the showis actually about. And we've just we we try to name our show is like very onthe nose like very direct B2B growth. And the reason our show has done sowell is we rank for the keywords B two b. And so our show name is GDP growthcolon, your daily B two B marketing podcast. So we rank for B two Bmarketing and we also rank for the term B two B. And I would say like try towork your the keyword that you want to rank for in podcast platforms into thename of your show. Uh there was a season where Apple was shutting showsdown that we're that we're doing keyword stuffing in the title of theirshow. So you got to be careful not to just keyword stuff. Don't put your showname colon, keyword line, keyword line keyword. But if you can organicallywork it in to the name of your show in like a tagline for the show. I foundthat that's that's really helpful. One of my friends shows he ranks for theterm senior living and his show has bridged the gap colon the senior livingpodcast. And so hopefully that's uh that's helpful. Uh because I thinkpodcast S Ceo is is definitely a...

...distribution tactic that I don't hear.A lot of people talking about. Hi dan Sanchez here with a quick break fromthis episode, sponsor Vidyard. If you haven't started using personal videoyet to enhance your marketing campaigns, your missing out having the ability toquickly capture video and record my computer screen or both helps me notonly create marketing assets faster, it makes them way more personable. I usepersonal videos and social media email blast landing pages and even on ourwebsite, Vidyard makes it easy to record host in bed and share videos tomore deeply engaged with your ideal buyers prospects have told merepeatedly that they are blown away every time they get one for me. So signup for Vidyard free today by going to Vidyard dot com slash GDP growth. Andjust like you guys, the team at Vidyard can't keep up with all these promocodes on podcast, so they are making signing up as easy as possible. So nopromo code needed. Just go to Vidyard dot com slash GDP growth to start usingVidyard completely free and as a bonus, get their 2021 B two B video transguide. Are you about to say something? Yeah, I just wanted to call out whatyou said there because we didn't always, our show has been B two B growth forfrom day one, right. And we've changed the cover art. We refresh that lastyear. The full name of the show with the subtitle is B two B growth, yourdaily B two B marketing podcast. Now we didn't always have that subtitle inthere and that's something that you could, you can change, you can iterateon overtime. But we noticed that once we added that subtitle um, in our hostplatform, we started to show up, I know if you search B two B marketing podcaston google, we will be right in one of those first slots in the podcastCarousel. So both Apple Search as well...

...as Google search, Google starting tosurface podcast. Much like they did video in the, in the early days beforethe Youtube acquisition. You know, we used to have to go to Youtube to find avideo. Now. If google says, oh, I think that James is looking for a video,you're going to get that little carousel video options right,podcasting is doing the same thing. And so even if you already have an existingshow and you're like, I don't want to rename my show, but it doesn't reallydo many search favors. Experiment with the subtitle of the show because thatcan help you in this area. Awesome. I see a question from Mirage. He says,for for the guests, is a regular laptop good enough for recording on zoom or dothey need to buy specialized audio equipment looking you, you jumped inand answered that. But I just want to make sure that we have this for anybodythat didn't see the comments and for anybody listening to this after. Yeah.For all of the shows that we produce for our customers, we provide a prettystraightforward equipment set up. You can see it on camera with, with Jamesthere, it's a $100 U. S. B. Mic from Audio Technica and some equipment toattach it to your desk. And we get this question. A lot of like do the guestsneed need something? A lot of the later model MAC books have phenomenalmicrophones to where it's really not so much of an issue as long as they're notin an echoey bathroom. And there was also a question about like video, justmake sure they don't have a light directly behind them and if they doturn it off, if there's a window closed, the blinds or re angle away from it,don't have a dog in the room, like you guys can probably hear mine barkingright now. So, and I think also since Covid, we've all been a little bit moreaccepting of recording in different environments. You have that already toyour advantage, if we've seen the tonight show from jimmy Fallon's livingroom, your podcast is probably going to be okay and just look to make itincrementally better as opposed to I have to have $10,000 worth of equipmentas the host and every guest, I need to ship them a microphone and ship it back,start somewhere and then make little...

...incremental improvements. Maybe youstart shipping them a $30 U. S. B. Mic or you work into your process. I'veseen Douglas Burdette do this with the marketing book podcast. He has a videowith a link to an inexpensive but high quality headset on amazon's like, hey,if you don't have a podcast mike, go by this and you'll use it, you know,outside of just being a guest on the podcast. So those are some things youcan do to address it, but I wouldn't make it everything or let it stop you.I mean, James mentioned at the top of this show demands in live from chriswalker and the guys at, at the team at refined labs. I've heard episodes oftheir show that are not the best audio quality, but the content carries theday and it's been wildly popular, both live and on demand. So it's not just usthat are saying that .2 other examples got a question from Michael, just morepractical about how to get on the list for these calls. Um, he said alreadygetting value today, how can I get my co hosts or others an invitation to theweekly meetings, Michael, If you'll just shoot me an email James at SweetFish Media dot com or have them email me and just say, Hey, I'd love to beadded. I'm doing it kind of ghetto right now. I'm just doing a googlecalendar invite. I've tried to find tools that where you can set up alanding page and I just haven't found anything that that works real well. Sojust have them shoot me an email James at Swedish Media dot com and I'll addthem to the recurring calendar invite. There's another question to hear from,from Peter, how to use your podcast and cold email outreach to talk toprospects or get their attention to your brand. This is obviously, thisseems very aligned with what I wrote the book about content based networking,but I think Peter you're actually on here. Can you elaborate on thatquestion a bit if you're, if you're still here? Yeah, mainly that I've beendoing a lot of cold outbound and started a podcast three months ago andI've found the open rates, click rates are good. Haven't got anyone to bite ona call to action. So just wondering...

...what other ways people are using umtheir podcast to get in the face of potential prospects. The best thingthat's worked for me is asking for people for 10 minutes of feedback. Theamount of people have replied and said they'd get on the phone with me hasbeen uh surprising. The other thing is just lining up my copy with their jobrole. So say, hey, I interviewed this S. E. O. Or this Ceo and then send it to aceo. So they let them know I'm talking to someone at the same level. And soPeter, are you asking those prospects, are you asking them to be a guest onyour show or you're just trying to open up a sales conversation with usingcontent from your show as kind of a lead in mostly just a lead in and brandawareness because a lot of times they might not be good on the podcast. SoI'm not using 100% just for finding candidates, rather getting them to payattention to me as authority and credibility and credible source um, andthen start a conversation. So eventually I have like a 13 emailsequence and, and I asked questions about every four emails and differentthings along the lines of you know, what are you doing to solve thisproblem or what's your biggest issue? Which podcast would you want to listento? And then they tell me and I know what their pain point is, Logan. Do youhave any thoughts there? I would encourage you to, to flip that a bitPeter and asked some of those prospects. I love to feature ceos just like youtalking about their challenges and the solutions they're coming up with. Wouldyou be interested in being my guest? Because then it's, it's about value forthem and not value and you helping solve their problem, which means abusiness transaction and your product or service but value to them. And oh,Peter wants to hear what I have to say. Not to qualify me but to share what Ihave to say with his audience. And so I think a lot of times and that's thisJames asked the same question I had. There's two ways you can do this, sendthem the podcast content to generate a conversation. But if you invite them tobe a guest on the podcast, even if you...

...haven't identified them as a greatspeaker, if they fit your buyer persona, they likely have things to say thatyour other buyers will care about you. Just might not know what that is. Andthat's where some frameworks in uncovering what their point of view ortheir experiences that we've armed a lot of our customers with comes intoplay where you can ask repeatable questions like Peter, what's a commonlyheld belief about being a ceo in the manufacturing space? Totally make it up.I don't know what what industry you sell to. What's a commonly held beliefabout insert title and industry that you passionately disagree with boom, nomatter who it is, what industry we have the potential to go deep on a topicthat's going to create good content. So I would say don't step over theopportunity to play to their ego and to deliver value in a different way,saying, hey, I've interviewed other great guests, but don't go listen tothem. I wanna, I wanna feature you and you'll get more yeses than than youthink. Why do you say peter? Why do you say that there are some people thatyou're reaching out to that wouldn't necessarily be a good guest for theshow. Is it because of the premise of your existing show? I don't think Ithink his advice about asking some more template id structured questions mighthelp it, but about a 30 of the people that I talked to just aren't up to thelevel of what I want in terms of quality. Uh they either just go on toolong. Uh don't say anything interesting, not willing to be vulnerable to use alot of vague language or just kind of a lot of like self help book talk. Yeah.And and one way that you could vet that peter and it gives you an extrarelational touch point is to do a pre interview I really like, especially ifyou're not talking to the chris walker's of the world folks that are onpodcasts all the time, but if you're just talking to practitioners, so forus, like on GDP growth, we're talking to VPs of marketing and a lot of BtBSaAS companies and more and more,...

...they're being asked to be on more shows.But in the early days none of them were being asked to be on podcasts. And soby doing a pre interview, asking some what we call P. O. V. Discoveryquestions Logan just shared one. What's a commonly held belief about B two Bmarketing that you passionately disagree with or what's something thateverybody be marketers should start doing or stop doing, identify a P. O. B.In that in that pre interview. And then during the actual interview, if youlike what they said in the pre interview, you can elaborate on thatand you can use that preinterview is kind of a no pressure way to and anddon't. And timmy on our team, he's a content strategist on our team. He likeyou mentioning, they're not willing to get vulnerable enough, give them thatfeedback, tell them like in the pre interview, like, hey, you know, wereally want a more vulnerable vibe on this show, um would you be willing topress more into that answer? And because you're not recording in thatpreinterview, they feel a lot more comfortable. I just found that folksthat are not accustomed to being on a lot of shows actually really enjoybeing on a pre interview. It makes them feel a lot less in their head and, andthey get to know you a little bit more as well. It's awesome. Thanks forasking that peter. I know we've got one more minute here and I've actually gota call at the top at the top of the hour so we'll have to shut it down.Unfortunately. Is there any any other questions on this dock or any questionsin the chat here that we want to close this out with Logan or dan that you saw?Saw C. J asked C. J. Crew's asked a question about Lincoln live. Check ifyou're not following Sandra battery at terminus, check out his feet. He'susing linkedin live and we're repurposing a lot of that content fortheir podcast to flip my funnel podcast. So just quickly, if you're looking forkind of someone who is kind of out ahead of that, we haven't done linkedinlive and all here at sweet fish, but that's one of our customers that is, soI would, I would check him out, yep. And that is the correct spelling. V A JR E is his last name. Sandra badger. If you type in san Graham terminus, youshould be able to find him. All right,...

...we are right at the top of the hour.You also thank you so much for being here. We're gonna record this willprobably see an email for me tomorrow whenever we get this live on Youtube.So we'll send it out to everybody. So there are folks from your team thatwant to uh, that you want to share this with, be on the lookout for that linkin the next couple days and then if anybody wants to, wants to join in,feel free to just have them email me James at Swedish media dot com and Iwill get them added to the calendar invite for these calls. See you allnext week. Mhm. At Sweet Fish. We're on a mission tocreate the most helpful content on the internet for every job function andindustry on the planet for the B two B marketing industry. This show is howwe're executing on that mission. If you know a marketing leader, that would bean awesome guest for this podcast. Shoot me a text message. Don't call mebecause I don't answer unknown numbers, but text me at 4074 and I know 33 to 8.Just shoot me. Their name may be a link to their linkedin profile and I'd loveto check them out to see if we can get them on the show. Thanks a lot.

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