Are You Focusing Too Much on Your Email Strategy?

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode, Timmy Bauer talks with Tory Kindlick, Marketing Director at Leadspace 

Mhm Yeah. Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of GDP Growth. I'm your host, timmy Bauer. I'm the content strategist here at sweet fish and my guest today is Tory kind like he is the marketing director at leeds space Tory, Welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for having me. I'm so excited to talk to you. We're gonna be talking about a topic that I've been fascinated with lately. Email. I feel like every pre interview that I've been doing at some point we get on the topic of email. I wonder if things are really changing in the world of email in marketing and uh you've got a point of view on this last time we talked, you said that email nurture programs are built in a way that suggests people buy in a linear fashion, awareness to decision, but that's just not. So, So first of all, what do you mean by that? Yeah. So I think that a lot of this goes back to years and years of marketers like focusing on the demand waterfall model. Right? And thinking that if we market to people...

...based on what stage we believe therein within the buyer's journey that it's going to expedite the buyer's journey. The reality is I don't believe that people buy in such a linear fashion. I think that there's certainly ways that, that you can use email and it can be, you know, a helpful tool as a marketer. But if you are focusing too much on email within your strategy and expecting that just by dropping someone into a nurture program that they're going to be that much closer to buying by the end of that nurture program, you're probably might want to recheck your strategy. You know, the reality is people do tons of research, email is one way that you can get some of that information and research in front of people, but more often than not, the best practices that people are using to build their email nurture programs was something that was written years ago. And the reality is that people don't actually By in such a quick timeline the same way that that folks are building email nurture programs. So to assume that just because someone, let's...

...say, downloaded a white paper and you drop them into an email cadence that was going to take them through 6-8 weeks, let's say of of email distribution. What's that said that that person is going to be ready to buy 6-8 weeks later. They might have just been doing a little bit of preliminary research when they downloaded that white paper. So there's just, there's too many assumptions that come with email nurturing and just in my career, I've just found them to be pretty ineffective. And I do think that there's ways to use email differently than, let's say some of these overblown email nurture programs and I will also throw the caveat out there that there are email nurture programs that that do make a ton of sense. But yeah, I think as far as just trying to bring in new customers by dropping them into a, you know, an automated email sequence, I think those days have come and gone. Yeah, well, I'm curious why you believe that, like what have you seen that has caused you to come to the conclusion that that is not email anymore. That's not how it should be done. I have personally bought hundreds of thousands...

...of dollars, if not millions of dollars worth of marketing technology in my career and I can't remember a single time where I got an email from a company and thought, you know what, That's really interesting. I'm going to go check out that product. I'm going to buy that product. It's not how people do their research. And so to think that you're going to be able to influence someone's buying behavior just based on some arbitrary timeline that you use to build out an email nurture program. It's not a great way to go to market. And I think if you, let's say use email nurture in addition to some other platforms too, you know, maybe encourage someone along the buyer's journey or distribute your content, That makes sense. But yeah, I think people are just too overly focused on email over the past several years and as someone that has been in the, in the buyer seat before, I don't see it as a very effective tool. Yeah. Why do you think that so many people don't see...

...email this way? Why? Why do you think that so many people are still doing email the way that it's been done? Yeah. I mean, I think a lot of it is just because those are the known and locked in marketing tactics that so many people have used over the years. And if you're continuing to use the same tactics and playbooks, then chances are you're going to need to refresh at some point. But I think that the people that that aren't taking a step back and looking at the strategy or you know, maybe those that have just never really dug hard into the details of, you know, is my nurture program actually having a positive impact on a, on a sales platform? Or am I perhaps just looking at cosmetic metrics like email opens and thinking that, you know, if someone opened an email that led to them buying something that some of those kind of let's call them false positives, so to speak. So those are I think what has created this issue and then just the lack of creativity and innovation I think is really more so the problem today that I just want to do things...

...that they're comfortable with. So speaking to that. So I've talked to a few people who say, why are we constantly trying to reinvent marketing rather than just sticking to things that we know works? Why do you think that this is not one of those places where we just need to stick to the playbook? I question if it is something that really has has worked, I don't believe that like, you know, maybe 10 plus years ago when there just weren't a lot of other options out there. That made sense when let's say the sellers, the vendors had a little bit more control over the buyer's journey. That made sense. Nowadays, buyers are in control, they have all of the information at their fingertips and if you're not putting it in front of them, if you're not being creative with the way that you try to deliver your message and your content, someone else is going to. And so I think that that's always going to be part of marketing, right, is trying to innovate and evolve and, and look, you know, a little bit ahead of the curve. And I think that...

...sure, there's kind of something to the whole don't reinvent the wheel, but I I don't think that this particular wheel is all that effective. Yeah. So if somebody was listening to this and they're like, all right, I'm tracking with you Tory. How do I do email? Right, What's step one for them? How did they start? I think it's all about knowing and focusing on on the ideal outcome, Right? And the ideal outcome cannot be sales. That would be great if, if we could just think about, you know, an email nurture program that was going to bring in more sales, but more often than not, that's that's not the reality. So I think being really transparent about what your, your ideal outcome is with the person that you're sending emails to. I think that's extremely important and making those intentions known to the person that can be really helpful to. So, you know, for instance, I think everyone's, you know, out there talking about trying to be helpful and sharing content and tips and tools. Yeah, that is correct. But you know, take a step back and look at if you're...

...trying to help yourself or if you're trying to help out the buyer. And one of the ways that I think I've seen email be a little bit more effective is when you're transparent upfront and saying, you know, I just wanted to share this piece of content with you, I wanted to share these tips to me. That's a much more appropriate way to use email as a channel and you know what, you don't need to put a call to action in every single email. You don't need to drive someone to your landing page or to your website with every single email. If your ideal outcome is to educate a buyer more about either what the problem is or how you can solve it, do that within the body of the email, send them all that information right there in the email. Don't ask for anything in return. That is a way to, to actually help someone versus trying to build an email that's almost click batey and really just trying to get someone to convert on that email and go to your website so that you can drive their lead score up. People have become wise to what happens when they click links and the automated cadences that that follow. So just move...

...away from those things and I think that you'll see that your email approaches your email strategies are going to benefit from it when you are more transparent and when you stop trying to use it as a sales tool and instead really use it as just, you know, a form of communication, just like a podcast or a digital advertisement. Yeah, well, my last question for you Tory is that if somebody was wanting to apply your advice so they're honestly trying to apply your advice, Let's say it's me, I'm honestly trying to apply your advice. How could I mess it up? I think that the biggest kind of misstep that people will, will make is maybe relying too much on, let's say marketing driven nurture cadence versus they sales driven nurture cadence. So, you know, nurture in and of itself, that is always going to be something that is important within sales and marketing, right? We can't just get in front of someone and never get back in front of them again. But I strongly believe that...

...these marketing driven email nurture programs, those are the ones with issues, those are the ones that are problematic and there is a lack of transparency or it's too self serving, whereas the 1 to 1 sales email where you can actually personalize that's a much more effective approach. And so I think the belief that email nurture is a responsibility of marketing maybe isn't quite so true anymore. And that that that should be, you know, if it's not a shared responsibility, something that the salesperson should really own as that relationship that they're trying to build the report they're trying to build, that's the ideal outcome of a nurture program is to help someone get your brand in front of them but don't annoy them. And I think that these kind of broad based spray and pray email strategies there an annoyance, whereas a legitimate 1 to 1 personalized email strategy that is led by a salesperson and A. E and SDR. That I think is really the right way to do...

...it, the right way to, to leverage email and not abuse email and still get in front of your client or prospect. And so that would be the way that I think, you know, it could be kind of screwed up is just thinking that we can still rely on like these these marketing frameworks that were built over a decade ago, You know, there's tons of great sales engagement tools out there right now. So see if your sales team and your BDR s maybe can have a little bit more of an impact with, with trying to nurture their prospects and build a relationship rather than, you know, trying to to let the marketing team do that. Instead, beloved Tory, thank you so much for being on the podcast. How can listeners connect with you? You can look me up on linkedin, there's not too many Tory can looks out there, so I think you'll probably be able to just find my name pretty quickly. Awesome. Thanks for being on. Cool. Thanks a lot to me. Mhm mm at Sweet Fish. We're on a mission to create the most helpful content on the Internet for every job function and industry on the planet for the B two B marketing industry. This show is how we're executing on that...

...mission. If you know a marketing leader, that would be an awesome guest for this podcast, shoot me a text message. Don't call me because I don't answer unknown numbers, but text me at 4074 and I know 33 to 8. Just shoot me. Their name may be a link to their linkedin profile and I'd love to check them out to see if we can get them on the show. Thanks a lot.

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