B2B Growth: Your Daily B2B Marketing Podcast
B2B Growth: Your Daily B2B Marketing Podcast

Episode 2040 · 4 months ago

Are You Focusing Too Much on Your Email Strategy?

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode, Timmy Bauer talks with Tory Kindlick, Marketing Director at Leadspace 

Mhm Yeah. Hey guys, welcome back to anotherepisode of GDP Growth. I'm your host, timmy Bauer. I'm the content strategisthere at sweet fish and my guest today is Tory kind like he is the marketingdirector at leeds space Tory, Welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for having me.I'm so excited to talk to you. We're gonna be talking about a topic thatI've been fascinated with lately. Email. I feel like every pre interview thatI've been doing at some point we get on the topic of email. I wonder if thingsare really changing in the world of email in marketing and uh you've got apoint of view on this last time we talked, you said that email nurtureprograms are built in a way that suggests people buy in a linear fashion,awareness to decision, but that's just not. So, So first of all, what do youmean by that? Yeah. So I think that a lot of this goes back to years andyears of marketers like focusing on the demand waterfall model. Right? Andthinking that if we market to people based on what stage we believe thereinwithin the buyer's journey that it's going to expedite the buyer's journey.The reality is I don't believe that people buy in such a linear fashion. Ithink that there's certainly ways that, that you can use email and it can be,you know, a helpful tool as a marketer. But if you are focusing too much onemail within your strategy and expecting that just by dropping someoneinto a nurture program that they're going to be that much closer to buyingby the end of that nurture program, you're probably might want to recheckyour strategy. You know, the reality is people do tons of research, email isone way that you can get some of that information and research in front ofpeople, but more often than not, the best practices that people are using tobuild their email nurture programs was something that was written years ago.And the reality is that people don't actually By in such a quick timelinethe same way that that folks are building email nurture programs. So toassume that just because someone, let's...

...say, downloaded a white paper and youdrop them into an email cadence that was going to take them through 6-8weeks, let's say of of email distribution. What's that said thatthat person is going to be ready to buy 6-8 weeks later. They might have justbeen doing a little bit of preliminary research when they downloaded thatwhite paper. So there's just, there's too many assumptions that come withemail nurturing and just in my career, I've just found them to be prettyineffective. And I do think that there's ways to use email differentlythan, let's say some of these overblown email nurture programs and I will alsothrow the caveat out there that there are email nurture programs that that domake a ton of sense. But yeah, I think as far as just trying to bring in newcustomers by dropping them into a, you know, an automated email sequence, Ithink those days have come and gone. Yeah, well, I'm curious why you believethat, like what have you seen that has caused you to come to the conclusionthat that is not email anymore. That's not how it should be done. I havepersonally bought hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not millions of dollarsworth of marketing technology in my career and I can't remember a singletime where I got an email from a company and thought, you know what,That's really interesting. I'm going to go check out that product. I'm going tobuy that product. It's not how people do their research. And so to think thatyou're going to be able to influence someone's buying behavior just based onsome arbitrary timeline that you use to build out an email nurture program.It's not a great way to go to market. And I think if you, let's say use emailnurture in addition to some other platforms too, you know, maybeencourage someone along the buyer's journey or distribute your content,That makes sense. But yeah, I think people are just too overly focused onemail over the past several years and as someone that has been in the, in thebuyer seat before, I don't see it as a very effective tool. Yeah. Why do youthink that so many people don't see...

...email this way? Why? Why do you thinkthat so many people are still doing email the way that it's been done? Yeah.I mean, I think a lot of it is just because those are the known and lockedin marketing tactics that so many people have used over the years. And ifyou're continuing to use the same tactics and playbooks, then chances areyou're going to need to refresh at some point. But I think that the people thatthat aren't taking a step back and looking at the strategy or you know,maybe those that have just never really dug hard into the details of, you know,is my nurture program actually having a positive impact on a, on a salesplatform? Or am I perhaps just looking at cosmetic metrics like email opensand thinking that, you know, if someone opened an email that led to them buyingsomething that some of those kind of let's call them false positives, so tospeak. So those are I think what has created this issue and then just thelack of creativity and innovation I think is really more so the problemtoday that I just want to do things that they're comfortable with. Sospeaking to that. So I've talked to a few people who say, why are weconstantly trying to reinvent marketing rather than just sticking to thingsthat we know works? Why do you think that this is not one of those placeswhere we just need to stick to the playbook? I question if it is somethingthat really has has worked, I don't believe that like, you know, maybe 10plus years ago when there just weren't a lot of other options out there. Thatmade sense when let's say the sellers, the vendors had a little bit morecontrol over the buyer's journey. That made sense. Nowadays, buyers are incontrol, they have all of the information at their fingertips and ifyou're not putting it in front of them, if you're not being creative with theway that you try to deliver your message and your content, someone elseis going to. And so I think that that's always going to be part of marketing,right, is trying to innovate and evolve and, and look, you know, a little bitahead of the curve. And I think that...

...sure, there's kind of something to thewhole don't reinvent the wheel, but I I don't think that this particular wheelis all that effective. Yeah. So if somebody was listening to this andthey're like, all right, I'm tracking with you Tory. How do I do email? Right,What's step one for them? How did they start? I think it's all about knowingand focusing on on the ideal outcome, Right? And the ideal outcome cannot besales. That would be great if, if we could just think about, you know, anemail nurture program that was going to bring in more sales, but more oftenthan not, that's that's not the reality. So I think being really transparentabout what your, your ideal outcome is with the person that you're sendingemails to. I think that's extremely important and making those intentionsknown to the person that can be really helpful to. So, you know, for instance,I think everyone's, you know, out there talking about trying to be helpful andsharing content and tips and tools. Yeah, that is correct. But you know,take a step back and look at if you're trying to help yourself or if you'retrying to help out the buyer. And one of the ways that I think I've seenemail be a little bit more effective is when you're transparent upfront andsaying, you know, I just wanted to share this piece of content with you, Iwanted to share these tips to me. That's a much more appropriate way touse email as a channel and you know what, you don't need to put a call toaction in every single email. You don't need to drive someone to your landingpage or to your website with every single email. If your ideal outcome isto educate a buyer more about either what the problem is or how you cansolve it, do that within the body of the email, send them all thatinformation right there in the email. Don't ask for anything in return. Thatis a way to, to actually help someone versus trying to build an email that'salmost click batey and really just trying to get someone to convert onthat email and go to your website so that you can drive their lead score up.People have become wise to what happens when they click links and the automatedcadences that that follow. So just move...

...away from those things and I think thatyou'll see that your email approaches your email strategies are going tobenefit from it when you are more transparent and when you stop trying touse it as a sales tool and instead really use it as just, you know, a formof communication, just like a podcast or a digital advertisement. Yeah, well,my last question for you Tory is that if somebody was wanting to apply youradvice so they're honestly trying to apply your advice, Let's say it's me,I'm honestly trying to apply your advice. How could I mess it up? I thinkthat the biggest kind of misstep that people will, will make is maybe relyingtoo much on, let's say marketing driven nurture cadence versus they salesdriven nurture cadence. So, you know, nurture in and of itself, that isalways going to be something that is important within sales and marketing,right? We can't just get in front of someone and never get back in front ofthem again. But I strongly believe that these marketing driven email nurtureprograms, those are the ones with issues, those are the ones that areproblematic and there is a lack of transparency or it's too self serving,whereas the 1 to 1 sales email where you can actually personalize that's amuch more effective approach. And so I think the belief that email nurture isa responsibility of marketing maybe isn't quite so true anymore. And thatthat that should be, you know, if it's not a shared responsibility, somethingthat the salesperson should really own as that relationship that they'retrying to build the report they're trying to build, that's the idealoutcome of a nurture program is to help someone get your brand in front of thembut don't annoy them. And I think that these kind of broad based spray andpray email strategies there an annoyance, whereas a legitimate 1 to 1personalized email strategy that is led by a salesperson and A. E and SDR. ThatI think is really the right way to do...

...it, the right way to, to leverage emailand not abuse email and still get in front of your client or prospect. Andso that would be the way that I think, you know, it could be kind of screwedup is just thinking that we can still rely on like these these marketingframeworks that were built over a decade ago, You know, there's tons ofgreat sales engagement tools out there right now. So see if your sales teamand your BDR s maybe can have a little bit more of an impact with, with tryingto nurture their prospects and build a relationship rather than, you know,trying to to let the marketing team do that. Instead, beloved Tory, thank youso much for being on the podcast. How can listeners connect with you? You canlook me up on linkedin, there's not too many Tory can looks out there, so Ithink you'll probably be able to just find my name pretty quickly. Awesome.Thanks for being on. Cool. Thanks a lot to me. Mhm mm at Sweet Fish. We're on amission to create the most helpful content on the Internet for every jobfunction and industry on the planet for the B two B marketing industry. Thisshow is how we're executing on that mission. If you know a marketing leader,that would be an awesome guest for this podcast, shoot me a text message. Don'tcall me because I don't answer unknown numbers, but text me at 4074 and I know33 to 8. Just shoot me. Their name may be a link to their linkedin profile andI'd love to check them out to see if we can get them on the show. Thanks a lot.

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