742: 3 Low-Cost Marketing Tactics That Get Tremendous Results w/ David Kelly

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode we talk to David Kelly, General Manager at KingSumo.

He shares 3 low-cost marketing tactics that they've tested & tweaked at KingSumo & Sumo Group:

  1. Viral Giveaways: low-cost but high quality leads as low as $.05/lead

  2. Wordpress Plug-in Content Blocker: how to gate content after previewing more of your blog post to obtain more leads

  3. LinkedIn Posting Strategies: how to write a good opening line, whether to include photos or videos & where to put your links for more reach on LinkedIn

Click here to connect with this guest on LinkedIn.

... to pay attention to your brand? Start a podcast and invite your ideal clients to be guests on your show. Learn more at sweet fish Mediacom. You're listening to be tob growth, a daily podcast for B TOB leaders. We've interviewed names you've probably heard before, like Gary Vander truck and Simon Senek, but you've probably never heard from the majority of our guests. That's because the bulk of our interviews aren't with professional speakers and authors. Most of our guests are in the trenches leading sales and marketing teams. They're implementing strategy, they're experimenting with tactics, they're building the fastest growing BTB companies in the world. My name is James Carberry. I'm the founder of sweet fish media, a podcast agency for BB brands, and I'm also one of the CO hosts of this show. When we're not interviewing sales and marketing leaders, you'll hear stories from behind the scenes of our own business. Will share the ups and downs of our journey as we attempt to take over the world. Just getting well, maybe let's get into the show. Welcome back to the B tob growth show. We're here today with David Kelly, general manager of King Sumo. David, how's it going today, man, Oh, it's going awesome. Logan, thank you so much for having me on the podcast. Really excited to get going. Hey, I'm excited to finish up my week with a great chat with you here and at this hope this episode will go live later, but we're both enjoying a sunny Friday afternoon right now, so looking forward to a great conversation on a Friday before we jump into some guerrilla marketing tactics that really really work and some really fun stories. I would love for you to take a second, David, and just let the folks listening to this know what you in the team at King Sumo were up to these days. Absolutely so. My role is the general manager of King Sumo, which is part of Sumo Group. If your listeners have heard of APP SUMO or Sumacom. It's the third aspect of that sumo group and our entire goal is to really make it easier and inexpensive for be tob businesses to grow their following. So we notice that facebook ads Seo outreach can be expensive in time consuming and our purpose with King Sumo is to make it much, much cheaper to do marketing activities that really work awesome. Well, that's that's an aim I think that can resonate with a ton of our listeners. David, so I said, I'm really excited about this conversation. So we have a few specific tactics you guys have have employed in some cool stories to jump into. So let's dive right in this first one that you mentioned as we were chatting offline was something you guys did in a viral giveaway. Yes, so Farro giveaways. People hear this and they think they have to give away like a trip to Bali or something crazy, or it's one of those scammy giveaways they see online, and both of those things can be true, but they aren't necessarily true. So, to give an example, in the early days of growing ABSUMOCOM,...

...which is now an eight figure company, about thirty percent of revenue came from viral giveaways, and we actually like doing vibra giveways so much we built this internal tool that we dubbed King Sumo and then release it to the world. And what we noticed with giveaways is that we're able to drive leads, drive customers, drive a lot of success for basically no money, and we have a few examples of people using it, like best selling Authors Ryan Holiday Shane Snow some other big companies like outside dot CEO, which some of you remote workers might have heard of. And we've seen people drive leads for about five cents a lead versus much more expensive facebook or Seo type advertising or work. Definitely, definitely more than yeah, Sen's a lead. That's right. And what's fascinating to is that people often think give ways lead to bad subscribers or bad customers, are just like annoying scammy people, and that isn't necessarily true. We've noticed that the quality tends to be pretty high and there are always people who kind of sneak in and they're just like the the free be moms we call them, who just sit at home all day and try to win give ways. But even if we say twenty to thirty percent or at maximum fifty percent of leads aren't as great as they could be. You're still looking at ten to maybe twenty percent per lead, which is still much, much cheaper than other marketing channels. Right for sure. So what are some of the ideas that you guys recommend? For be tob marketers trying to start out with viral giveaways? So for beb marketing specifically, it's really focusing on finding a really specific targeted product towards your audience, right. So an example we can give is we had this woman named Marie who is a fitness grow essentially, and she gave away a few fitness products within her product suite, so her own personal product sweet which cost her no money, and then she also got a couple partners to give her free products to give away. So in the BB space we've seen people do partner give ways, let's say with some other tools in the marketing space or some other tools in the sale space or crm space or whatever it is, and they're not only able to drive those bb late leads for real cheap, they're also able to leverage their partners for more audience growth and to show the give way to more audiences. HMM, yeah, very interesting, man. Well, going off of that, so talking about, you know, getting these leads for much, much lower than you know your costper lead, say with a facebook add. There was another story that you guys had in using a content blocker. Yeah, yeah, he's book add strategy. Tell us a little bit more about that story. Yeah. So I guess the crux of this conversation is, like we're just really cheap. We just like doing things really inexpensively. So trying to find those gorilla growth marketing tactics at work for a growing start up where we...

...don't want to spend tons and tons of money and don't have a very large team and like to remain nimble. We're just hacking together things and trying different things and I think this is one your audience will really like. I'm curious to hear what people think about this after the show. And this is called a content blocker and we actually have a tool. If you want to email me at David at King Sumacom after this conversation, I'll give you this free word press plug in and basically what it does is you can install this word press plug in or just as line of code and it kind of disallows someone from reading the entire article until they give their email address. So some people might have seen this on Tim Ferris's blog in the past year or so. We I think we're part of the inspiration for him to do that. And what this content blocker does is we used it to drive facebook add traffic to a blog post on our site and then collect email addresses from the blog post and we were able to get down our lead cost to about a dollar per lead, and it's not bad for facebook ads. It's not as cheap as giveways, but we were able to get some quality leads for relatively low cost, which was a really fun way to hack it together and it was just a free word press plug in we just kind of built behind the scenes. So cool thing to do. Yeah, so walk me through, you know, the thinking behind the content blocker versus. You know, I'll pop up or something else to than, you know, collect that that email address or just entirely gating the content? Any thoughts on why that was more effective? Yeah, it's a combination of actually gating and popups, which I think it pulls the best inspiration from both. So the thing we noticed with popups and our sister company, Sumacom, is all about pop ups and generating for us and Legion forms to make it easier, and popups work really well for the most part, but we do notice set it isn't necessarily as contextual and it can be kind of annoying if you're reading a piece of content and this thing just pops up right and you can also just x out of it very easily and quickly and there are no repercussions and it's it's really easy to bypass. Now with an entire gate. It gets kind of annoying because you can't even see a preview of the content, like a lot of these newspapers are doing now, so you can see if this content is interesting to you. So the content blocker we created allows you to to set like the percentage scrolled depth before the content blocker shows. So, for example, we would set it to twenty, two, thirty percent so someone could read part of the article, they could understand it, decide if it was right for them and then, if it was right for them, they could give their email address to read the rest of it and if that piece of content was interesting, were in many ways helping them see more pieces of content by emailing them in the future that are similar. Right, so you're you're gaining the content but not really on the front end, and that that really you know, that makes sense. I mean I don't know if I'm just a typical millennial, but...

I actually have a journalism background. But you know, the news sites that totally went to, you know, a subscription wall really, really far on the very front end. You know, lost me a long time ago, even with my animals and background in my you know, passion for, you know, seeing good journalism. You know, get paid without knowing what I was going to get. You know, it becomes a little bit tough. So I think the psychology of that is kind of interesting and just that you're providing a little bit more before you asked for something. You're still doing early, great, you're getting a little bit later. Very interesting. Yeah, this third topic that you guys have seen in just inexpective ways to get organic reach, get more leads or get low cost leads, is something near and dear to my heart because, you know, the team here we've been talking about linked in for a while. We've really doubled down on linked in the last six to twelve months ourselves. So tell us a little bit about some of the tactics that you think, you know, some of our audience might be missing on getting more reach on Linkedin. Linkedin is a really, really interesting one and I think the crux of giveaways and the content blocker and Linkedin is that with marketing this a really fine line between being annoying and aggressive and just doing kind of a moral things and making sure to drive traffic and results while still kind of benefiting the user. And we notice that with giveaways, where we're trying to avoid quality products. We're trying to tell people grow their business, to add actual you to their customers. So no bate and switch. And then the content blocker very similar, with showcasing some of the content and only if people like it they're able to add the content blocker to the site to get those emails subscribers. And linkedin is very similar. So we notice with linkedin this is under our CEOS account, so we post under a personal account. Not We get about exactly. We get about three to ten times a number of clicks versus twitter, despite having half the amount of followers. So we have about sixty one thou followers to our CEOS personal twitter account. We have about thirtyzero followers connections to is Linkedin accounty. And despite that, on Linkedin we still average about a hundred and sixty one clicks per post and we've seen multiple posts in the seven hundred eight hundred click range, including one crazy, crazy post that got about eighteen hundred clicks, which I think we're going to talk about in a little bit. It's also a little bit more about some of the the formula that you guys have seen worked on Linkedin, because as we are chatting offline, David, you mentioned a couple of things that you guys have tested and have tracked over time. So I think some of those tactical takeaways would be awesome for our audience. Yeah, absolutely. So we've done a pretty deep data and correlation analysis for our linkedin posts and over the past year we've done about a hundred linkedin posts and we had...

...some really interesting finding. So I'm going to share these with all the listeners. Really curious how they work for your listeners. And it's important to keep in mind that this is just kind of a framework. So we're constantly testing, we're constantly iterating. So this might be a good place to start, but inevitably there are improvements that can be made. So the first thing we noticed is the first two lines that people see are the most important, and this might sound kind of obvious, but on linkedin status updates. People need to remember that the first two lines are the lines that are shown and the rest of the status update is hidden. Unless someone who makes of you more see you really, really really have to hook them with those first two lines and get them to click for you more, because that's kind of the cascading effect of getting people to then click, engage, interact, comment with your post. So that was a givest thing. Yeah, and going back to my journalism background, as as they say, you know, don't bury the lead, you know, don't don't put the most engaging point at the very end. Lead with it and then you might have to back up and tell some more story. But what if you write that post, think about what is it? What is the key piece here, or what? How could I phrase it to really make it interesting? I mean, you know, if it's Super Click Baiti and people just, you know, associate your post with not good content, then it's never going to work in the long term. But I see a lot of people that are here in good content but they're not thinking about that first line or two. Totally totally agree. And then, as an extension of that, and I think you bring up a really good point with making sure not only the first two lines are really sticky, but making sure that you really earned the lead throughout the entire message. We notice that the median of our most successful post had about six hundred and eighty eight characters and only three of our top ten posts had greater than a thousand characters. So for us that shows that typically shorter post, really to the point post worked very well. And you talk about being a millennial. I'm millennial to and I think we can both relate to just not wanting to always necessarily read really long posts or really long, like tell all novels on social media, and so we can try to keep it short and millennial or not, we're all busy, man. We all exactly want to get the most bang for a buck in the time that we spend consuming the content. Right exactly? What are your thoughts on on images and links in those status updates, because we've found some some specific things there that tied a metrics. Curious to see if you guys have have talked about or seeing any correlations there. Okay, I'm curious to hear what you guys have seen. So for us we notice that links are okay and we even tried some things like posting the link or editing the link an hour after the post went live, two hours after the postm one live, three hours after post one live. For our experience, and this might differ from yours, for our experience, links,...

...they they work fine. There's no increase or decrease if we remove the link or add in the link later. It just doesn't seem to matter. Images, on the other hand, seem to really lower the overall fews and lower the overall clicks. How did you guys do with your images? You don't your links. I've seen three things and you know we've encouraged people to, you know, do the the the Linkedin Hack, if you will, of putting the link in the first comment, because we do tend to see that that extends the reach. You know, I can't say that we've tracked it metric over metric, you know, time after time, but I know personally I started doing this combined with some other things, and I literally one hundred X my linkedin views. There's a number of things I did besides that. Some of the stuff that you're talking about we definitely included, but I definitely see that. You know, we've seen that to totally agree with you, David, on the images and even videos. For as much as, yeah, in video is hot right now, I can do a post that's text only if I do one that it includes a video, even if it gets similar engagement, you know, same number of likes and comments in the first day. The views don't quite seem to get there as they do the text only posts totally agreat. That's what we notice, since you bring up a really interesting point too, because in our correlation analysis we did, we notice that like likeke's most highly correlate to views and then use most highly correlate two clicks. So it really does start with getting those likes and then the the views kind of cascade from there into clicks. But yeah, we notice the same thing with images and video, which is fascinating for us. Yeah, yeah, the other thing too is that, at least from what we've seen, linkedin's algorithm really does look at the amount of engagement that it gets, not only just over the life of the Post but within the first hour or two. To us it seems like those number of likes and comments are really crucial in the first hour or two that an update goes live. And so one thing we've encouraged people to do that. We work with and just chatting mount linked in and stuff. Is If you do post and you get a lot of likes and comments in that first hour or two, engage with each one of those, because that's going to allow, that's going to you know, encourage more like so, someone comments, you comment back. Normally they might not comment again unless you're really getting into a good conversation, but they'll probably like that comment that you left in reply to their comment, and so that that engagement can kind of snowball and I think, especially if you pair that with engagement groups and some of these other tactics that you've been sharing, people really can exponentially increase their their linkedin visibility pretty quickly. It's got to be, you know, it's got to be good content, but once you layer these on top of decent content, you will definitely see some results. So really interesting to hear that you guys are seeing a lot of the...

...same things I was. Specifically, I wanted to round out the conversation with a quick story. You guys had on a Linkedin Post. Yeah, yeah, so we have a great story about this. So we have our CEO and our founder of Sumo Group claims himself as a world's worst investor, and it's pretty funny because we recorded this video all about cryptocurrency and how he had just put a couple thousand dollars in cryptocurrency and he was talking about where he thought the crypto market would go and hit the crux of his conversation was people are just over reacting. No one really knows what's going to happen. It's just kind of a fun thing to do. Just do it if you want to, but don't do it if you're trying to get rich or you don't know what you're doing. And about two days after he posted this video and we posted a linkedin post about this, the crypto market crashed and so the joke is that in fact, the CEO and founder of my company is probably the world's worst investor. And it plummeted shortly after that. But this post we had a really strong intro, really strong first two lines. At the very bottom of the post we linked to the CRYPTO video and it got eighteen hundred clicks, which is just an insane amount of clicks. And when we think about where those clicks went to, it went to our youtube channel, which is one of the most important marketing channels for us in the B Toc and B tob spaces. So not only is it just like kind of a fun, funny story, but it really drives results and I think it's a great lesson for B TOB marketers to keep in mind that it's fun to post these and it can also be beneficial to the company. Yeah, yeah, awesome. Well, I love that story. I think, David, you had a ton of really tactical stuff for our audience to take away from this. If folks want to stay connected with you, follow what you and the team at King Sumo and the sumo group or up to, what's the best way for them to go about doing that, for sure. So thanks again for having me Logan and if people want to contact me, just David at King Sumacom, feel free to ask me for the content blocker. I'll send a longer way, or just ask about tacos. I'm happy to talk about that anytime. You can also check out our site at King Sumacom and then, if you want to see just really short blog posts that I post like once every four years when I feel like it, you can check out my personal blog at DMK. Thanks, Dot Org. I love it. I love it, David. This has been a phenomenal conversation. Man. Before we let the audience go today, we're going to give a quick shout out, as we've been doing for the last week or so, to the flip my funnel conference coming up in just a few weeks. As of the recording of this episode, August eight in Boston is going to be the flip my funnel conference. It is going to be a great event. I've seen the speaker lineup. We've been talking to a lot of the the speakers and folks that are that are going to be there. A lot of be tob marketers and a lot of great stuff on account base marketing is going to be happening...

...then and we've got a Promo Code for you guys that is be tob growth. Be The number to be growth, just like our show name. If you go to flip my funnelcom click the two thousand and eighteen conference link. When you go to buy your tickets, use that Promo Code, be tob growth, and you get fifty percent off the price of admission and we look forward to seeing a lot of our listeners, past guests and a lot of industry experts in the B to be marketing space in Boston in a few weeks. There are lots of ways to build a community and we've chosen to build the be tob growth community through this podcast. But because of the way podcasts work, it's really hard to engage with our listeners, and without engagement it's tough to build a great community. So here's what we've decided to do. We're organizing small dinners across the country with our listeners and guests. No sales pitches, no agenda, just great conversations with likeminded people. Will Talk Business, will talk family, will talk goals and dreams, will build friendships. So if you'd like to be a part of a be tob growth dinner in a sitting near you, go to be to be growth dinnerscom. That's be to be growth dinnerscom. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time,.

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