597: 4 Keys to Marketing with a Small Budget w/ Taylor Shanklin

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode we talk to Taylor Shanklin, VP Product Marketing & Strategy at Pursuant.

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tshank/

Are you struggling to come up withoriginal content weekend and week out? Start a podcast, interview your ideal clients, let them talk about what they care about most, and never run outof content ideas again. Learn more at sweetfish MEDIACOM. You're listening to theB tob growth show, a podcast dedicated to helping betb executives achieve explosive growth. Whether you're looking for techniques and strategies or tools and resources, you've cometo the right place. I'm James Carberry and I'm Jonathan Green. Let's getinto the show. Welcome back to the BB growth show. We are heretoday with Taylor Shanklin. She is the VP of product marketing and strategy atpursuit. Taylor, how you doing today? I am excited to chat with you, Taylor. We're going to be talking about marketing on a small budgetand and when we were talking about this offline, you said, James,want to talk about marketing like you're a seven hundred pound gorilla and I thoughtseven hundred pound really shit. Oh Yeah, yeah, I'll explain why. Sevenhundred pound and I'd a hundred pounds. So I'm excited to to dive intothat explanation. But before we do that, Tello listeners, a littlebit about pursuing it. What are you in your team up to over there? Cool? Well, Hey, thanks so much for having me on.Excited to talk about this. At pursue it. We are a full servicefunduise, an agency working with nonprofit organizations, and we really kind of dig inwith organizations, help them do deep analysis of their data and really kindof bring get insights into how they should be thinking about their donors and theirmarketing strategies to build, you know, stronger, deeper relationships with their donors. So we've got a kind of, you know, full service team,fundraising, consultants, web developers, videographers, creatives and House Yeah, interesting.A lot of people come from the nonprofit space, so we really kindof have a group of what I call...

...true practitioners. I love it.It's a tailor as we dive into this topic, this idea, I thinkthis is going to be very attractive to a lot of people talking about marketingon a small budget. But you you said that it really there were fourkey areas that that you wanted to focus on, the first one of thosebeing resourcefulness. Can you you know, as it relates to having a smallbudget. Actually, before I get into resourcefulness, rewind. Explain to methis idea of marketing like a seven hundred pound gorilla. Yeah, so Idon't know. I had this idea about a seven hundred pound gorilla because Ifeel like what's amazing to me these days is with with tech, with allof the different marketing tools and things you can be using these days, it'sreally actually become pretty inexpensive to look like a big gorilla. But at thesame time, I want to be realistic here and say that if you don'thave an eight hundred pound gorilla type of company budget, and like, let'sbe realistic, you don't, but you can get just about there. Youcan look like a seven hundred pound gorilla. Yeah, you want to, evenon a, you know, a thin budget, I love it.I'll and so you obviously have have been able to pull this off, andresourcefulness being kine of the first pillar of this mindset. Talk to us aboutand what does resourcefulness look like? How do you think about it as asit relates to having a market on a small budget? Yeah, I definitelythink it's a mindset. So a lot of these things I want to talkabout to day. It's a mindset. Resourcefulness be and I think one ofthe first ones you really have to kind of wrap your house head around andthink, and I think it starts with if you don't have a big budget, or maybe you don't even have really hardly any budget at all. Maybeyou're just trying to get started in something and you've got a thousand bucks right, and you're like, what can I do? First off, don't feeldefeated, because if you go into it...

...from the mindset of feeling like well, you know, I just can't compete, then you're not going to be successful. So you've first got to wrap your head around not feeling to feedit and sit down and kind of jut down a list of what can youcan control, what can you do for free, and then figure out,you know, what you need to spend a little bit of money on,and then also figure out, okay, these are the couple of things thatI know they're going to be expensive. They're just kind of always expensive,and if there's five of them, let me figure out the top one orthe top two right. So I think it's kind of about, first off, you know, not being defeated, figuring out what you can control andthen, you know, kind of going and into it with that approach.Gotta will also say, and you know I'm guilty of this, I thinkmarketers, it's like we all kind of we easily get excited about new shinyobjects, right, it's maybe like our nature. But stop trying to doit all and sit down and think about anything that you're maybe currently spending moneyon. That might be a waste of money. And just because you've alwaysdone it that way doesn't mean that that's the best way to do it.Now everything changes quickly. So maybe you've got chatch keys that you take toa conference and you're always taking these chatchkys to it to a conference. Butlike and maybe you like them and you think they're cute and you think they'refunny. Right, but maybe people who pick up this chatch keys aren't actuallypeople who are going to a buy from you and be maybe they're just goingto get the church key and throw it in the trash. So, like, is that really the best way to be resourceful and to spend your money? Lastly, on this topic, something that I've really learned how to doin the past couple of years, is to find a freelancers on outsourced websiteslike fiber yeah, like a work and use freelancers who live in other partsof the country, I mean not other...

...person the globe, that are wildlytalented that maybe just don't cost as much. And so if you need to kindof think outside the box, I think outsourcing to through those sorts of, you know, outsource networks, maybe we'll call them, is a greatway to do that. That's absolutely something that we've done a lot and goingin with the expectation of knowing there's probably there's going to be a little bitextra management on your end because to a certain degree, you know, youget what you pay for. But they're there are still some wildly I lovethat you mentioned that, because there are wildly talented resources all over the globethat, just because of the economy and their area, happened to be waymore affordable exact. And so if you go into it knowing, okay,if I'm if I'm willing to massage this a bit and go back and fortha little bit, I could probably get, you know, as a steal ofa deal on on something that would have cost me, yeah, andsometimes ten times more. Yeah, it's wild exactly. Just to give youan example of that. So, couple years back I was at a company. We're trying to start our own podcast. Right, we had one of ourdevelopers who happened to be a musician, cutting and doing our editate and andeverything like that. Right, yeah, Yep, but we needed him developingthe product, right, we didn't need him spending time on that.So I found someone in South Africa on Fiver who did a fantastic job andthere was a little bit more back and forth in the beginning, but oncewe kind of got over that, we got into a pattern and worked reallywell together and it costs so much less money. It was really just addinga lot more value to what we were trying to get done at the endof the day. Yeah, now I love it. So, Taylor,this next piece that we're going to talk about is relationship building. And so, as it relates to relationship building, how does this tie into marketing ona small budget? Yeah, I think that there's a lot you can doin looking for opportunities to comarket yourself with...

...other people and other businesses where youhave a nice symbiotic relationship. Right. So I think it's thinking through,okay, what kind of value can I bring to the table? Who elsein my sector might find that valuable and might want to partner up on mewith things? So maybe you want to go in and do an event togetherand you share the costs of that, right. But there's a lot ofthat kind of relationship building that you can take into activities which are free,that you don't have to spend money on, you know, writing, you know, crossblogging, that sort of stuff. So I think a lot of itstems from working really just on being a better networker, working on buildingrelationships with people where you can kind of bring each other good vibes, goodyeah, yeah, resources, and then everyone kind of wins. And soagain it's like it costs you time, it doesn't cost you hard dollars thatyou have to put out. Yep, and often times when you're having tomarket on a small budget, it's it's the time that you have and thedollars that you know. And so the idea of really spending a lot oftime being thoughtful about how you can bring value to someone you know. That'sthat's been a game changer for us as we've continued to develop our own ourown podcasting service, leveraging that to say, Hey, how can we leverage ourexpertise in this to be able to partner up with other folks that aregetting article placements in large publications or you know that are that are doing differentevent marketing things like how can we trade or how can we work together,because we have a tangible skill set to offer, and so I think that'ssomething it's easily forgotten. I think it's it doesn't feel natural at all forme to just ask a favor without figuring out how to give value that.I've been in this mindset for a while. So I love that you talked firstabout figuring out how you can add...

...value and then thinking about, okay, what, how can we leverage this to for it to be a winwin. Yeah, people, you know, people on craigslist of barter for goods. Why can't you barter your marketing? Yeah, that's kind of the wayI look at it. Yep, your spot on this third pillar thatwe're going to talk about, Taylor, is learning. Talk to us aboutlearning in the context of marketing on a small budget. Yeah, so learningis also something that is free to do. Right, you have to spend yourtime doing it. But if you spend the time to learn, tolisten to what other people are doing, to read the blogs, to watchthe youtube videos, there's so much content you can get there for free becausepeople like us are putting out content for free, right. And so Ithink education and kind of constantly trying to educate an evolve yourself and keep upwith what's going on is really important and it will lead you to new waysof doing things that don't cost that much. So one of the things that I'vebeen really focused on in the last couple of years as like, okay, digging into to tech, to inexpensive tech that I can use that helpkind of propel what I'm trying to do. Right. It's kind of amazing tome now when you sit back and think about okay, here's a commontopic that marketing teams are often discussing. We need a new website, butwebsite redesigns are expensive, take a lot of time, they are a biglift, right, and they are. And if you want to have areally super fancy website, yes, it is. But again, if you'retrying to think through, okay, how can I be more efficient, howcan I build a website that the marketing team can actually, you know,manage themselves and doesn't require a ton of extra outside development help. Then,you know, it's like there's things like strikingly wicks, we rely, youknow, wordpress. You can go out,...

...you can start with a template,you can go hire that designer on upward to help you with some graphics. Yeah, and it's just kind of amazing to me that, like thisday and age, you can actually build a pretty awesome looking website for afew hundred bucks if you want. Yeah. Yeah, so it's kind of educatingyourself on tools, you know, looking for what's a video platform thatI can actually use and not need video editing skills for, Yah know.Yeah, graphs program that I can use, like canva or something like that,that doesn't require me to be a photoshop expert. Yeah, one ofthe resources that we mean it's probably one of the most valuable resources that we'veinvested in since the start of our business, was a service called Capa Ninety nine, Kapa nine nine, and it's a graphic design shop that you basicallyget to design jobs a day for. I think their rate is like fourhundred a month, and so it's just outlandously affordable. The amount of designwork that we get done because we're working through a service like that, asopposed to bring you on an inhouse designer is, you know, again goesback to the you know, there's there's oftentimes some massaging that needs to bedone, but a lot of them, you know, if there's templates,like for this show, we do daily graphics on a daily show, butit's a template, and so at this point, like there's really no managementthat needs to happen. It's just, Hey, this is what we needdone. And so resources like that, I just think, are so underutilized and often times I think it's just because of a lack of awareness thosein a few years, though, I think, I think it's going tobe hard to not know about these folks because the word of mouth, that'sI mean me talking about cap. I talked about Kapa that till pretty muchevery conversation I have because of how helpful they are and how affordable they are. So I totally agree. That's awesome. And See, I hadn't heard ofthat one before, so now I'm going to do now you're learning inwork, all right. So so this...

...fourth pillar, tailor is creativity.Talk to us about talk to us about this one. So this is aboutbeing interesting and again, like that doesn't take money to be interesting. Youjust have to think outside the box of like how can we get creative hereand do something that's going to get attention, that's going to be interesting, that'snot gonna be stiff and boring like every other company? And are,you know, space or Amen, there's and doing right. I think thatit's people are often so risk averse to using humor and they're getting so thatyou mentioned, you know, yeah, the just like taking some risk,but honestly, like that's what we as humans want to connect with. Yeah, so I think creativity is just like spend a little time. If youare feeling to like, okay, well, I don't know what to do,just start googling funny phrases. Yeah, and you will start coming up withideas. Did there was actually one of my kind of favorite examples ofsomething I've done that I was going to a conference. I think this waslast year. Didn't have really much to spend in my budget beyond just kindof showing up at the conference and bringing our booth and our typical stuff,but I kept feeling like, okay, this. I know the audience atthis conference and they are quirky. That the kind of people that like Internetcats and stuff like that, right. So let's be fun and Quirky andlet's build some buzz and do something interesting. So I get this idea of okay, I want to do something with a Unicorn. Then I'm like,I don't know what. What do I do with a Unicorn? I likethe figure of a Unicorn. I think these people at this conference will likeUNICORNS. So what can I do? That's not going to cost a lotof money. Like nor really have the budget to go make cool Unicorn shirtsor anything like that. So I start googling Unicorn and I see this imagecome up of one of those like horse...

...masks that's a Unicorn, you knowthe kind. Is that funk kind of horse skinn it and the action figures, and so I'm like Huh, okay, so I like this Unicorn head.Now what do I do with it? And then started thinking through. Okay, well, we could have people, we could I could go buy afew of these masks. We could have people come by the booth andtake pictures with the Unicorn mask and do kind of like a photo contest andjust get people interested in the fact that it's just kind of funny. Youdon't? Yeah, yeah, I got little, you know, I gotUnicorn Chatch keys right. So again, like it was something that was funny, like little catcorn pins and things like that, and I even started thinking, okay, how do I tease this out before I get there? So, like you have to do a little self deprecation sometimes. I mean,I took pictures of myself at the airport wearing the Unicorn head on the planea yes ahead, and then I started sharing that in the conference APP.So a lot of times now to when you're thinking about, okay, we'regoing to a conference, how do we kind of boost up our presence there? If there's an APP that the conference is using, the people are goingto start engaging with start engaging in that way and getting social and sharing funnypictures and stuff like that. So, yeah, that's just kind of oneexample where it's like, okay, I think I spent the hundred bucks total, but it got a lot of attention traction. Everyone thought it was funnyand and it was a good show. Yeah, I'm so glad you mentionedthat. We just launched our first funny video campaign and are around kind ofmy obsession with Gary Vander Chuck, and so the series is Gary v wantto be and it actually stemmed from something Gary told me when I was interviewinghim back in May. He said what Dollar Shave Club did was brilliant.They had one video that went viral because it made people laugh and then theygot acquired for like four billion dollars.

Now that's obviously not that's not thebath that everybody's going to take. But doing something that actually makes someone laugh. Who Doesn't want to laugh? And so I don't see bedb brands thinkingoutside the box. Like what you the thing that you just talked about?That's fun like, who doesn't want to be a part of taking taking apicture with somebody in a Unicorn mask and like and doing those, like doingcreative things like that. I mean our first video had over fifty seven thousandviews on Linkedin and it was the first one of a series that we're goingto be doing, because the stuff just works, and so I think there'sso much power in creativity, in trying to be funny. It's obviously not. You know, the only thing that you need to be doing, butI love that you brought that up because I think it's super valuable. Taylor. In closing, I would love for our listeners to get to know youjust on a little bit different level. Could you share and what is thelegacy that you would like to leave? Yeah, so's it's an interesting questionand I'm going to throw kind of a maybe different, different answer back atyou. Yeah, I have not really that focused on my legacy, okay, but maybe I'm thinking about it differently than some other folks. I'm reallyactually just some more focused on kind of the here and then now, okay, and making impact and bringing the value to people now. I don't know, I kind of with with legacy. I struggle because I kind of feellike, well, once I'm like dead and gone, why do I careit is dead, you know, like, yeah, I don't know what thelegacy matter so much. What matters right now is the people who whoare also living with me, breathing on this earth right now, trying toget things done and and of course it's like I do want to you know, my kind of passion, obviously, is in the nonprofit sector. SoI've been working with nonprofits for a long time. So it ultimately this greatergood of really like change in the world and and helping to make a betterworld for my kids and all of that, and I'm not really overly concerned withlike what people will think of me...

...when I'm gone. Make sense,makes sense. Awesome, Taylor. So if there's somebody listening to this,they want to stay connected with you, they want to learn more about pursueit. What's the best way for them to do that? Sure you canhit me up on linkedin anytime. I'm pretty active there on Linkedin. Youcan check out pursuantcom. That's Pu are Su Antcom, or you can justfeel free to shoot me an email. I'm Taylor Dot Shanklin at pursue andcom. Wonderful, Taylor. Will thank you so much for your time today.This has been incredible, so I really appreciate it. Hey, thanks forhaving me. It's been fun. If you'RE A B Tob Marketer, wewant to feature you on sites like the Huffington post social media examiner in chiefmarketer. Every week we send that a question related to be to be marketing. We use the responses to those questions to fuel the content we write forreally popular websites. So head over to sweet fish Mediacom slash questions and signup today. Thank you so much for listening. Until next done.

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