586: Podcast Advertising: What B2B Brands Need to Know w/ Patrick Lennon

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode we talk to Patrick Lennon, Co-Founder of Veritone One.

In today's episode you're going to be hearing from a gentleman named Patrick Lenin and we're going to be talking about podcast advertising. So I thought it would be a really great time to tell you about a new podcast advertising model that we are actually deploying for this show that you're listening to be tob growth. We have started partnering with BB Brands and instead of doing the traditional fifteen second or thirty two ad spot or even the mid roll add we're partnering with sponsors and actually building entire episodes around the success stories of our sponsors customers. And so we recently partnered with bound bound three hundred and Sixtycom and we've done three will be doing three interviews with their customers, and so it's been a really effective model. I feel like it adds value to the listener to hear real success stories from customers that are using, you know, the litany of Martech solutions...

...that are on the market today. But it also helps the sponsor by allowing their customer to do their marketing for them. And so if you are a you represent a BTB brand looking to dip your toe in podcast advertising, we would love to chat with you to see if there's some synergy there and possibly feature your customers stories on this show. On BB growth we're getting just a right around fiftyzero and downloads every month. Our listeners are BDB marketing leaders, CMOS, VP's of marketing agency CEOS. We would love to partner with you, so shoot me an email, james at sweet fish Mediacom. And here is our episode with Patrick Lennon. You're listening to the B tob growth show, podcast dedicated to helping be to be executives achieve explosive growth. What do you're looking for? Techniques and strategies or tools and resources? You've come to...

...the right place. I'm Jonathan Green and I'm James Carberry. Let's get it into the show. Welcome back to the BB growth show. We are here today with Patrick Lennon. He is the CO founder of veraitone. One, Patrick, how you doing today? So Great. Thank you. I'm really excited to chat with you today. Patrick. We're going to be talking really about offline marketing, brand specifically with podcasts. Is a space that you and your team are very familiar with. Excited to dive in to that with you, but but to give our listeners a little bit of context. Can you explain what is Faratonel on? What are you guys all about? What are you and your team doing over there? Sure, thank you so veryitonal one is a full service media buying agency. However, we do have a technology division which is verytone, which is probably traded, and that technology platform allows visibility and optimization that really hasn't been seen before in terms of offline media and...

...that that's considered radio, television, Youtube and podcast. So we handle everything from director spot television to audio to podcast at to Youtube, and we do it for some of the biggest ECOMMERCE brands out there, many of which your listeners use every day, like goober or word dress on websites or linked in, when you're using linked in. So we use a plethora of different media types and we scale campaigns to a to an effective CPA. I love it so, Patrick in in diving more into that, we're going to talk specifically about podcasting and some of the results that you guys are seeing in a higher level. They're when it comes to the media buying for for podcasting. What have you found to be the variables that really make for a successful podcasting campaign from an advertising perspective the question and podcasting is sort of a phenomenon because there's no limit insight in terms of how much content can be put into the universe.

So new content coming on every day. We manage between four hundred and six hundred shows a week podcast integrations, and what we do is we target the first take internal research, so we check all the boxes of all the internal research, you know, items that we have, from pod track to all the different research tools, to make sure that we're taught, looking to the right demographic, we're talking to the right consumer, whether it's be to BEBTC, etc. Etc. Then, once we do that, we take internal research and internal research tells us we spend tens of millions of dollars on podcasts and we understand sort of what works what doesn't work to a CEPA, to a demographic. So sometimes the show might look wonderful on paper and MPR show, let's say, on podcasting, but we know, based on creative restrictions, based on what MPR will want, when you to do whether it's a pre roll add, a mid roll add or a post role add, all those things come into play in termss of driving an effective CPA for for...

...campaigns. We're seeing a lot of growth, lot of success with be tob and have been doing this now with legal zoom for fifteen years in radio and now moving them into more podcasts because the space is so fruitful for kind of efficiency PAS. I love it. We've we've started bringing on more sponsors, specifically a lot of Martet companies, because our audience is made up of bb marketers and so this is this is a area that I'm very interested in. As far as the measurement, you said that you know they're performing really well. What are some of the metrics that you guys are using to measure success of a BDB brands podcast advertising campaign? Sure, so, every every client we have has different success metrics, Apis call them. So whether it's a CEPA to a new to install, so, whether it's a free trial, it's just it really depends on what that clients metrics are. We have real time dashboards that allow our team to in take from a number of different methods...

...data from our clients. So we can literally turn results around from unique landing pages. So when we go into a podcast campaign, traditionally podcasters have sort of branded podcasting with a unique url, so that's called indirect so indirect attribution will tell us how many unique visitors came to a to a site, let's let's say it's legal Zoomcom, slash NPR or legal doom not atom Corolla. Then we know, based on the traffic it's coming into that unique url, what our cost per uniques are. What are conversions? We can follow that consumer all the way through the funnel. We can see what lifetime value looks like, we can see what average order value looks like. Then we capture the indirect on the website, so the main site of Legal Zoomcom. We might have a different method of capture there, whether it's a survey, whether there's a lot of different ways we capture within either pre or post survey.

So we have different methods of doing it. And then our analytics team, we have afore analytics team, devises a collaboration between each client so they're comfortable with the measurement tactics. And then we optimize our day to day basis on a weekly basis and then we cut those shows that aren't working and we add the shows that are working. Love it that. Can you speak, patrick a little bit to the creative element of what makes a podcast ad from your experience, what makes it successful? So creative, creative speaks to each host right and a mistake often times is taking one creative and dispersing it amongst, you know, one thousand, five hundred and twenty three forty host and saying okay, each involunteer speaks the same way. We have unique copy that's actually drafted for podcasters because podcast, you know, each host reads differently. Some like copy points, some like scripts, some like more banter. So there's...

...just there's just a different variety of them. We have a full creative team podcast writers. It just right for podcast medium, for the podcast medium, so they know sort of how to speak in that language. So it really depends. I mean certain brands are more of integration in terms of a banter with a creative and some some host will read straight, you know, from the script. Not Not that one host reading from the script doesn't do as well as a hosted is more banter, but you know he shows does it differently. Got It, Patrick is. There's somebody listening to this right now and they're thinking, okay, I've been hearing a lot of people talk about podcasts advertising. I've been hearing some success stories, but you know, I'm brand new to this. Are there any and of words of wisdom or maybe mistakes that you see brands making when they when they venture into podcasts advertising that you would warn them about? To the person who have maybe hasn't done it yet but they're about to step into doing their first campaign? It's good question.

I think the thing that we recently get a study that showed if a client comes in and spends less than seventy five thou over three months, and typically what we tell clients has spend between Seventy Five Tho hundred and twenty five thousand over three to four months. Okay, and literally a x more success model comes when people spend that amount of money, because we've taken test that are fifty, that are twenty five, and there three times more likely to succeed in the scale if they step between seventy five and one hundred and twenty five. So the goal here is not, from an agency standpoint, to get more budget, because any agency that has the right depth behind it is upside down on a test. They lose money. So between manpower, between negotiations, everything that we do. So it's really to not get a false negative on the channel, because you have enough inventory out there and enough shows out there to optimize and to get enough of a read, because shows are,...

...you know, they take a while to work sometimes. So I was like, don't spend too little, but don't spend too much. Okay, that's that is a fantastic piece of advice. It's super, super specific, Teken, so I really appreciate you sharing that insight with this Patrick. Oh Yeah, for sure. We walked away from clients and said just save you money. I mean we don't. The end of the day. We keep clients, you know, for ten, fifteen years, you know, because we treated like it's our money and we just we've seen too many people come in and say, okay, I want to spend tenzero and we say stay in digital, stay in print. You know, where you can actually track it. There's so much breakage and what we do? You have to really invest the time and resources it. That makes perfect sense. Is there there anything else related to podcast advertising, Patrick, that you think our audience should know before before I get into our last question today, Gum, I would just say that podcasting is changing a bit in dynamically inserted adds versus embedded. So the way podcast first started was inbedded ads would live within a show for...

...perpetuity. So hypothetically, let's say you know Alec Baldwin on here is the thing which the MP our podcast five years ago. If that show is running, that add that he read, that he interviewed Michael Douglas, let's say, would stay forever. Your ad would stay in there. Nowadays, what they're doing, the bigger shows are doing it already. About forty percent of shows are doing it. It's dynamically inserted. So you're buying impressions. So basically the add still read by Alec Baldwin, let's say. But what happens is as soon as you get your agreed upon number of impressions, your ad is removed and a new AD is put in. So be aware of dynamically assorted. Be Aware of embedded versus that. In a clincer, we like to have embedded because embedded works better, because it has a longer shelf life and you get drag okay, so that's one thing. Also, be weary of buying just pre roll beginning of an ad, beginning of a show or...

...post is something that you should really be buying almost it no charge or getting for a very low amount of money. Okay, so those are just some high level topics. Are Howl, some mid roll, kind of mid roll host read ads are really what brand should be focused on. Those are the best. You know those are. That's the preminamentory because you have a consumer that really doesn't even know it's an add but pre roll you skip through and post role people have checked out. Mean there's value there, but it's just, you know, you got to just be able to measure the value by by what you're paying for it. All right, Patrick, well, this this has been fantastic. I want to close with one last question, which you know, is a question that I've been asking my guests in the last few weeks. I've been loving the responses I've been hearing. But Patrick, what is the legacy that you'd like to leave? You know, I'm unique in the sense that I started the media agency side of the business when I lost my vision. So I'm blind. I have a little Bit of vision my right eye, so I'm legally blind. So I've started foundations and then different things for the blind and low vision and I think the legacy I'm I'd...

...like to leave is that anybody can do anything if you work hard and you know that. You know you don't give up. So I think maybe there's there's you know, there's a lot people don't do because they just give up. Yeah, man, that has a fascinating story. I had. I had no idea that you had lost your site. Yeah, that's incredible, Patrick. If somebody is listening to this, they want to stay connected with you, they want to learn you're more about Bariton one. What's the best way for them to go about doing that? Just hit me on Linkedin, Patrick. Last name El n o n very tone. You can find me pretty easily, or feel free to shoot me an email to Patrick at arytone Vril anynecom and I'll gr back there and thank you for the thanks for the chat today. No problem, Patrick. Thank you so much for your time. I really appreciate it. All right. Thanks. Said Bay, to ensure that you never miss an episode of the B Tob Growth Show,...

...subscribe to the show and Itunes or your favorite podcast player. This guarantees that every episode will get delivered directly to your device. If you or someone you know would be an incredible guest for the B Tob Growth Show. Email me at Jonathan at Sweet Fish Mediacom let us know we love connecting with be to be executives and we love sharing their wisdom and perspective with our audience. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time.

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