544: Digital Ad Creative in a Programmatic World w/ Jeremy Carlin

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode we talk to Jeremy Carlin, VP of Business Development at Jetpack.

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremy-carlin-05942420/

Are you struggling to come up with eoriginal content, weaken and weak out start a poncast interview, your idealclients? Let them talk about what they care about most and never run out ofcontent ideas again, learn more at sweetfish media Dolcom, you're, listening to the be to b growth,show a potcast dedicated to help him be to be executives achieve explosivegrowth, whether you're looking for techniques and strategies or tools andresources. You've come to the right place, I'm James Carburry and I'mJonathan Green. Let's get into the show. Welcome back to the bee Ta Bee GrossShow. Today we are joined by Jerreny Carlin Jeremy is the vice president ofbusiness development at jetpack. Jereny welcome in the shel. Thank so muchforoter me Jeremy. It's a pleasure to have you on the show we actually Jeremy.I just talked for like half an hour before we started to Recordi. It was anamazing conversation. We were just sort of catching back up when all the stuffthat's been going on. I'm doing a a new halowoed horrornights h thing here inOrlando Jeremy was telling me about how he recently got engaged and h is youknow now in sort of wedding, planting modes- O that's fantastic Jeremy, andwe are officially going to be talking today, though, about a digital adcreative in a programatic world and I'm thrilled to have you unpack that forour listeners. But before we do tn, you can tell us a little about what you andthe jet pack team are up to these days. Certainly so, jetpack digital has beenaround for over eight years. At this point AH started by three men who comefrom the publisher world and started a publisher that at the time it wascalled Buzzmedia that eventually became spin media and then spin media, I think,was sunsetted this year. Actually so it was, it was around for a while but m.The founders had been Kinda done with that for a while, so basically whenthey left their kind of publishing background, they kind of startedjetpack as a response to all the gaps that they had seen in the marketplace,specifically as it as it relates to ad creative, so and creative kind ofbecame. Our signal call we'd. Do it by a a few different service models,including Manag Service, that has been arbred in butter for the entire lengthof time that we've been around? U That's having our clients send us anysort of assets, full hose images, and then wekindo jumble that all together and put out a specific format or a way for theactual agcreative to be viewed in a a fun or different way, and we do that wehave not only do we do that by a Mani service where we're doing the the kindof product building and then we also have a self service portal where wehave our clients go in and build it themselves. Um tends to be a little bitmore cost efficient, we're actually...

...putting out our self service tool intothe market within the next week. So ere super excited about that big productlaunch, O coming and H. Yeah no were we definitely have some really cool thingsto come. We have been around for a while, but I think we're starting tomake us splash these days, because ther just aren't that many people who dowhat we do any more, which is focus on the publishing environment. You know,content creators aggregators and provide those folks with genuine andininnovative creative across multiple digital screens, Lat's fantastic, we'relooking forward to h to seeing what you guys are are cooking up in the verynear future, and today we are going to be, like I said, we're talking aboutdigital ad creative in a programatic world that feels like a very densesentence, jerry, let's Hel me unpacked at a little bit for ourlisteners, certainly so programatic for any folks that deal in the advertisingworld, specifically digital, but starting to be other elements as well.Anyone who deals in the median environment has heard of the termprogramatic for folks that have not basically it's an automation of the wayP ads are bought and sold through digital channels, and basically it hascreated. It comes first there's a in order to scale something you need tohave a standard for it right, there's standard Um way in which everyoneeither does whatever you're doing that, an that way. Since everyone's doing itthe same way, then you can grow it and more people can do it the same way,Blah Blah Blah right so by creating basically standard adsizes years andyears ago. Most of the time, I think the first standard adsizes were puttogether by a few different companies, Google being one of them, and basicallythey created these different standard adsizes and by doing so over the yearsand automating those different standard addsizes. It's brought in exchangedlike environment to digital media and that, as had a whole range of differentconsequences, including on you know what we're going to talk about today,which is that creative, a and I do and sort of this. This first question Iwanted to ask: I mean it almost feels like you're already getting into it. IsYou know what is standard media? How does that fit into the media landscape?You know, especially when we are talking about programmatic, automatedbuying, certainly and a good question. So the first thing I'll say is that programatic has basically shifted the way that thatfolks, really by purchase, think about whatever ithas to do with ads. Now that is very specific to ACD creative because, as Imentioned, there's these different standard sizes for desktop it's, it'susually pixels, so it's o e hundred and...

...sixty by six hundred three hundred bytwo fifty and seven twenty eight by ninety again, if you're intizile media,this is old hat to you, mobile three, twenty B Y Fifty, so we've scaled atthis point, all all the major publishers online right, sell out viadirect means much lower than it used to be, but, let's just say thirty percent,so let's say you're a publisher and you sell out thirty percent of yourinventory. What are you going to do with that? Other seventy percent, whichis mostly made up of the the sizes that I just spoke about, you're, going tosend it out to other people or give it to different exchanges and differentauction buying sites so that other people can buy and service yourinventory and pay you to to get on your sight, because that's what that's whatit is right, impressions Iballs, that's what o r our whole business is about.So because programatic is you know, technology focused, and you know it'ssupposed to be about automated buying. It was really supposed to bring allthis efficiency for time and and money, and you know, since all this stuff hasbeen. You know you don't have to email another aid to find out about theinventory details and see if what kind of budget requirements they have andall these different things that go into you know doing an RFP and getting aresponse and and actually doing business programatic was supposed tocut all that stuff out. So it's supposed to be much cheaper and you'resupposed to have be able to to do more with less people and all that all thatjazz and unfortunately it really hasn't gotten gone. That way. In fact, pricesin programatic platforms tend to be anywhere from ten to twenty percenthigher than direct sold inventory. It's actually cheaper to go through directsoul than not go through these automated channels. For what we'retalking about today, creative wise programatic has really strangled whatwe can do on a day to day basis for most creative endeavors. I I saw afigure this week. That said, fifty percent of display inventory in Europeis programatic at this point. So that means that fifty percent of theinventory is spread out between the basically these fours, the FORC sizesthat ie mentioned earlier. So that's kind of strangled on how mdigital content and and and creative have kind of meshed it's hard to domore high impact, funner higher and innovative creative, if everything'sone standard sise, and that basically has caused the strangulation of anysort of creativity in the marketplace and unfortunately, that's a problem.You know. That's not that's not something, that's good for publishers,that's not good for advertisers, and it's certainly not good for users, soyeah, so all right, then, Jeremy, ony. Let me follow up that question withanother one. Then how would you say that M folks are should differentiate theirnonprogramatic and their programatic...

...inventory? I mean, I think, there'sjust ways in which they're different in general, I mean obviously the easiestway to determine which is which is. Did you go on a platform and purchase theinventory and, and if you didn't then you're not doing it programatically ifyou made a call or sent an email to an a nd and talkd to him that way, mOzart's direct now the programatic channel has that as well. It's notcompletely devoid of you know having to make all those phone call right, but Hu,the human element, you cant. U Can't get rid of it entirely a y. Youdefinitely cannot in general. I think, there's a few ways in which programaticand non programatic kind of play one another. You know, I would say thefirst one which has been had a profound impact, is that most advertisers aresearcher searching for audiences, whereas earlier they had been searchingfor different and different websites. Specifically, so I think in the rfs ofthe past, which in my old days wis, I was a media buyer all those years ago.Basically, you know I would send I', have different buckets and I'd say.Okay, I have this lifestyle product, you know or something I want to beplaying my ad units on a lifestyle site, so I would reach out to the as manydifferent lifestyle sights as I thought I needed to and see what they couldgive me and all that good stuff. That now nowadays have changed. I I think,Um you know advertisers have gotten a little more savvy. They have. You knowmore interested, I marketing folks that create actual targeted. You know theycreate H, targeted profiles for their client base that they're looking to toget by viatheir products and really it it doesn't. Wor people don't worry somuch about what specific website you're on as long as you can get to whateveraudience, you're actually looking for which I think is a pretty different wayof thinking about it. Yea You can. I mean you can get so hyper specific withthese with the profiles that you build out and so incredibly targeted. I seewhat you're talking about and there's so many layers of data that you can puton to anything to to target everything, and I think that kind of playsintocreative which I'll talk a abot a little bit later. But you know first,one's kind of audience versus website. Second, is really like guaranteedinventory versus nonguaranteed. You know if you're doing programaticinventory, if you're buying your your impressions by Othe programatic channel,then it's never guaranteed that you're going to have the same atuand, it'savailable that you did before if you're buying a specific audience and you'redoing it across a multitude of sites. Maybe one of those sites is where youreally need to be, but it's hard to to see that because you're running acrossall these different websites and that might not be there the next time youwant to run a very similar campaign because who knows t af, thoseimpressions are going to be available, whereas if you're going direct- and youare talking directly to a publisher- you know CNN- say e CNN- I have you-know two million impressions this month t and I'm going to have two millionIMPRESSI EX MOM CNN says: okay, of course, yeah well reserve those twomillion two million impressions of...

...inventory N Echquarter no big deal. Ithink that that is a a way retaining business tends to do with Roi and agreat way to have consist in ry is to have consistency of where you'rerunning your your aunits, and I think when you talk about having an audienceand just talking about the programmatic channel, you lose that a little bit. Sothat's another difference. You know, fixecpm vers is an ECPM. You know NECPM in general, it's effective CPM, which is basically the average of allthe different CPMS that you're purchasing at versus. You know it's alittle bit simpler when you go straight to a publisher and say: Hey, I'minterested in purchasing innentory at a ten dollar SPM and they say: Okay, youknow ten dollars. It is so it's just the little nuances that I think kind ofdifferentia between nonprogramatic and programatic, and those tend to have aninfluence in general, I'm creative twell and it's it's interesting. I think any timeyou're talking about creative, but also consistency- and you know I mean it'sjust it's very difficult to- I think, blend those two things together. Whenyou think creative, you think, okay, you know inspiration and you know whowho knows exactly when this is going to be done or ready or how successful. Butyou also need that level of consistency. 'cause, it's still a business yeah! No,and I I think you you bringing up a very good point. You know, I don'tthink a lot of people talk about creative, you know and consistency inthe same sentence, because it's usually I honestly, I don't hear the wordconsistency much in my business period. You know it's usually like. What's theShinig new object or what's this or that you know, I don't hear the WordHey, I would love to have consist in performance or you know consistentelements in my creative that that match you know I jujst, don't think a lot ofcompanies. Slash advertisers in general have those thoughts, because thingsmove so quick that it's hard to maybe take a step back and look at themackrel elements when you're kind of tied in the day to day a lot. So that'san interesting point. You bring up honestlywell nd, so I think that thatleads us into this next question is that you know what is the main thingthat you see playing out in the acgrative portfolio space right now.You know, we've talked you know a decent amount bout. You know what isprogramatic and you know how that possibly relates a little bit tocreative, but I think programatic, as I e said before, you know, kindo cause estrangulation of different inventory, but I think there's been anotherunintended consequence and that's basically, what we are talking about,which is a main tame, which is how display video andmanae are all slowlybut surely merging. You know, even for the company that I worke forspecifically jeppack. You know we were mainly interested even two years ago.You know we were mainly interested in...

...jesttop specific display, creative andI think, little by little you know the opportunity for direct sold business,which is where we do. A lot of our work has slowly gone away because ofprogramatic elements, so we've had to differentiate, we've had to you knowkind of figure out ways to innovate, and I think one of the main ways we'redoing that other than coming up with as many inovadive creative formasses. Wecan- and you know, working with our clients to do so, but we're trying tofind interesting ways to include video, we're trying to find interesting waysto include social and find new ways to include Mobil for video and and NativeMobil. You know trying to find ways to take our technology and utilize otherelements of what we do in order to create new revenue streams, because,honestly, we need to do that advertises and brands, especially for creatcreatively, speaking advertises and brands love that shining new object.Now they they're usually interested in in what the actual content of the AD isand they're, usually the ones providing that, but as to how any sort of bellsin whistles or anything that's fun or or interesting, added to it. It tendsto come a lot of times from you know. Third Party elements such as myself, soyou know trying to find new ways to innovate and come up with new revenuestreams and still able to match that kind of you know shiny objects. Mindset,though, a lot of advertisers have specifically, especially when it comesto creative. It's it kind of necessitates US merging all thesethings and playing around in each one of those fields. It's tough slending itat times and if you're, not innovative, and if you're not trying to push indifferent areas- and you know, come with different native elements, whichis which are elements that look like whatever that's an Aguna that lookslike the page around it or the content around it or coming up with differentways to utilize videos such as outstream formats or formats that areliterally inside the content and m coming up with new ways to to givepublishers revenue streams you we have to be doing that we have to beservicing our clients, and you know that's kind of one of the things thatprogrammatic has forced out of a lot of h, the companies that share a similarposition to mine, Gan. Well, so jermy, we I mean: We've we've delled into sortof standard versus non standard. Digital ad, creative programatic versusnonprogramatic. We've talked about marrying display native video otherelements, so, let's taking is all together. Why does any of this matter?What is the lesson that we're leaving our listeners with today? You know, Ithink that it's so funny, because when you think about just the the youknow, marrying you know or talking...

...about display and mator or ad creative.It seems like such a tiny little thing right. It seems like like who care likewhat does it matter, but you know it's really interesting because in my opinion- and I think, if you'lltalk to most regular people who utilize any sort of digital screen weather,it's mobile tablet, Dust Top, O tt over the topboxes like Rocu or Xbox, oranything like that. The Ad Element in any of those platforms affects the usergreatly. Not only are they looking at the ad unit as actual creative that Rexcuseme as actual content s as something that they're consuming, butif you have bad ad content or a bad ad experience on your website or whateverdigital platform you're looking at it affects the user greatly. If you havebad ad creative that breaks your sight and the user can't consume the content,that's a big deal. If you have at creative, that's superinterruptive andyour editorial doesn't really match with that and it's something where theusers have to concentrate on whatever they're readingand you have a super interuptive, Agu n. It that's not good. If you have the most boring accreative,which at this point I can tell you a lot of the the potential clients that Isee really do. If you have boring ACD creative, it's you're almost missing anelement to your sight, because if you had interesting ad creative, not onlycould you be making money, but the users would appreciate it too becauseagain they view it as another sort of content that they have to actuallyconsume, and you know whether it's display a creative, whether it'sfinding different and interesting ways to utilize video, the output of allthese different median media endeavors of so many people. You know the peoplethat were talking about you know utilizing all the different data day,parting negotiating all the different prices, getting all the ad creative setup the end. outpoint of all of that is an ad creative being shown to the user,which is hopefully the right user at the endpoint of all that work. So ifit's not up to par, then the user, all that work is definitely going to be fornothing. So you know I I find it to be a really interesting topic and one thathonestly, I think people don't think a lot about. I think people put not thatmuch investment in the main publishers, the big boys, the teer one, a guys mtell you about major cable com, viacop Terner NBC. You know the majorbroadcasters CBS. Those guys are just now, starting to figure out that theyneed to put some. You know more effort and investment and and more kind of just effort behind agcreative they're,creating internal teams talking to different vendors, but the futurerelationship of us as the imediate...

...industry, with the user base ofwhatever country you're. Trying to you know, run media in the future of ourrelationship depends on us finding innovetive and fun ways to show our adsto the users, because you know, as I'm sure, a lot of people immediate read,you know, pay walls are coming up, viewability becomes more important, addfraud blocking and just add blocking in general, like publishers having theirauts blocked. These are all things that are effects of having the same crapcreative years. You know people got sick andtired of viewing the same crap, so they started to innovate on how to not haveto view it and consume that content, and here we sit. So I think it's reallyimportant. I obviously I'm a little Piasse, but you know, as you coald seethere's there's,usually a lot to talk about what atcomes that I creative so absolutelywell an and Jeremy. No one can certainly doubt your passion andexpertise for you know what we're talking about today and if any of ourlisteners are interested in following up they wan to know more about. Youknow digital ACD, creative and a programatic world. They want to knowmore about jetpack. They want to connect with you what's the best wayfor them to go abou, doing that by email's, probably the best way, myemail addresses Jeremy and Japa dot. Nat Super Super Simple. We adjectedJETPACK DOTCOM for many years, but people started calling and asking usabout how to get actual jakpacks. So we Wen CEAC BU yeah. No, we certainly are readywillianable to help anybody with any of their creative. Her should be ACcreative issues or questions or problems and yeah we're certainly hereto help that's fantastic charmean. Thank you against so much for your time.It was a real pleasure having you on the show. Today. He was well Ma'amthanks for so much for having me again. Hopefully this wuld this time wasn'twas a little bit more coherent tthis. This time this time was partet andagain. I'd also like to say again: congratulations on your impendingnutials, that's fantastic! Also. I appreciate that man thank so much Ta,I'm glad things in Florida are a little bit better than they they wer last week.Thank you, TAK! You! I have a go on Youto. If you're a Bauby Markee, we want tofeature you on sites like the Huffington Post, social mediae, examineearth and chief marketer. Every week we seen that a question related to be tobe marketing. We use the responses to those questions to feel the content. Wewrite for really popular websites so head over to sweet fish, med, tcom,slash questions and sign up today. Thank you so much for listening untilnext time.

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