531: Sales vs Marketing: The Role of Original Content w/ Kurt Shaver

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

In this episode we talk to Kurt Shaver, Chief Sales Officer at Vengreso.

There's a ton of noise out there. So how do you get decision makers to pay attention to your brand?Start a podcast and invite your ideal clients to be guests on your show.Learn more at sweet fish Mediacom. You're listening to the be to be growthshow, a podcast dedicated to helping be to be executives achieve explosive growth.Whether you're looking for techniques and strategies or tools and resources, you've come tothe right place. I'm James Carberry and I'm Jonathan Green. Let's get intothe show. Welcome back to the BE TOB growth show. Today we arejoined by Kurt Shaver. Kurt is the chief sales officer at Van Gresso currentwelcome to the show. Hey, Jonathan, excited to be here. It's greatto have you on the show. We've actually we've gotten to talk toyou some really amazing members of your executive team, Mario Martinez Junior, BrentTillman, and now we're getting the opportunity to bring you on. And todaywe're going to be talking about the role of original content, and that's kindof as it relates to both sales and marketings, not just not just marketing, but also talking about the sales aspect, and in some ways it's a bitof a continuation of what we got to talk to Mario about when duringhis episode. So I encourage all of our listeners to to listen to thatepisode as well. But before we get into today's topic, maybe you cantell us a little about your background and and maybe any updates with that withthan Gresso. Sure, thanks, Jonathan. Yeah, so my background is reallyin corporate sales. I was a in the Tech Business for about twentyyears, everything from starting in sales to work in my way up to theVP of sales of a global software company, and then in o eight I wentout and started my own sales consulting business and part of that I endedup teaching people how to use linkedin.

But then when Linkedin went public inMay of two thousand and eleven, I just looked at that event and Ithought, wow, this is going to be the biggest thing in B tobsales for the next decade. That was my guests and I just stopped doingeverything else and I went all in on teaching settle seems how to use linkedin. And you know what they say, it's better to be lucky than good, right. That was that was a good call. And then so threemonths ago, as Mario told you guys a few week or so ago,we had seven of the country's digital sales and marketing experts all merge together intothis one, the super team called Ben Gresso, and our focus is reallyto help B tob companies leverage digital sales and marketing skills and tools in orderto drive revenant. Yeah, that's fantastic and certainly the people on your teamthat I've gotten a chance to talk to you and or interview on the showdefinitely know their stuff. So congratulations on the on the current success of BenGresso. And you know, like I said, this is a bit ofa continuation, but we're going to be talking about some new stuff as welltoday on this episode. When we were before we started recording and we werewe were talking about what might make for some strong content for our listeners andwho our audiences. You know, we had started to touch on this ideaof inbound content marketing and you know, I think most people are familiar withit, but you know, Kurk, tell me a little about what thisidea of inbound content marketing means, at least for you. Well, forme it's just a way to attract people to you. It's a way toincrease your visibility and your credibility, and that could be either viewed from theLens of a marketing person when they think of the company's brand, or couldbe viewed from the lens of a salesperson when they think about their individual brand. But you know, it basically all comes down to the fact that theInternet shifted the power in terms of the...

...buyer accessing information. So they did. You know, Jonathan, when I started selling the the salespeople are thecustomers, would eagerly await my arrival and their office because I was the keeperof the information. Right. That was thirty years ago. That is nolonger that. They can access anything they want up the Internet, and somarketers realize that the whole I did inbound content marketing was a way to buildvisibility, increase credibility and attract people to you. So the and again.That's probably be going on in marketing bird ten years ish. But it's theadvent of social networks and really the emergence and popular of social networks that nowgives that same kind of content distribution power to the hands of the individual andwell, can apply to any employee in the company. Certainly sales people arethe best equipped, for a number of reasons, to be the company's greatestcontent distribution resource. Yeah, and and you know, I think, aswe talked to so many guests and so many professionals and executives and this ideaof aligning sales and marketing, it's exactly what you're talking about. I meanyou have sales people, the role that's evolved over the last thirty years andchanging into this idea that they can be your greatest content distribution channel. Soincluding them in this discussion is is not just valuable but but necessary. So, curt, let's let's talk a little about sort of this idea of okay, so how much of this is a sales role and how much of thisis a marketing role? Kind of where is where is the overlap, andare there any hard lines that need to be drawn between the two? Well, the hard lines are quickly disappearing. I mean again, with the perspectiveof thirty years then, Biz, I say that never before has the possibilityand really the need for sales and marketing alignment been greater. And that's becausereally, marketers are becoming more like salespeople...

...and sales people becoming more like marketers. And what I mean by that is when I say marketers becomeing more likesalespeople, what I mean by that statement is, you know, marketers usedto be don draper and madmen and thinking up creative coke commercials in this suiteover a Martini launch. Right, it was totally created. Marketing used tobe creatives. Now marketings are marketing is more data scientists than they are created. Right. So they're all about the numbers, they're all about the analytics, they're all about AB testing and splits and everything else. So I wasin an IBM conference three years ago and they had just released a research paperand they said by two thousand and seventeen, the CMO will spend more money ontechnology than this ce ioh. Well, that sounded like a boat. Thatsounded like a bold statement in two thousand and fourteen, but we arenow here. Yeah, and so that's what I mean by markers being moresales people, that they're sort of numbers driven. When I say sales peoplebecoming more Mike, Marketers is like, oh, now they have the keysto the content castle, right, because the platforms give them the distribution andthe content in many cases is easily accessible. They can build their each individual canbuild their own audience and they can build their own content distribution source andthey can build their own brand. And so a veteran sales person just alongtimes, just and how that they don't have the mindset of the of anindividual professional brand. And so that's where we got to start. Hm.You know in your mind there are three main areas of contents. Let's let'skind of dive into that. Yeah, so again, if we look ata be to be cooperation green, sales and marketing, so that the baseline, the foundation of a type of content would be mark company created content,things that you're marketing department right, that has the skills, they have thestaff, they have the resources, they have the photo shop, they haveit whatever, you know, whatever they need. They are creating that content. That's going on blogs and brochures and white papers and Info graphics and andeverything else. So that's table stakes.

And and absolutely the sales team shouldbe sharing relevant content for their market that comes out of their content, thatcomes out of their company. HMM Level One. Okay, level too,and now I'm mostly stepping into sales, although marketing can still do this alittle bit. But Level two would be general industry information. So it's notyour company propaganda, but it's what is happening in your market, right ofmarketing, automation, supply chain management, hospital it, you know, thestaffing, whatever your industry happens to be, it's what's happening there and that's inyour industry magazines, your trade associations, just you know what, whoever theinfluencerer that are talking about your industry. But the area that fascinates me becauseprobably because I'm a sales guy and because it's the like cutting edge,frontier, barely scratched area, is number three. So number three is originalfield generated content. That usually means sales people generated content. Now, whenI say original sales generated content, usually both marketing and sales people, althoughright there, let they puck her up, because because marketing is worried that somerogue sales person is going to just completely chatter the brand and sales thinksto themselves like I don't have time to write a blog. Right. Sothat's that's a vary, it's it's a fun, controversial subject out of it. But here's the thing. So writing, when I talk to salespeople about greatoriginal content, that doesn't have to mean writing a blog. There area lot of other things and some cases more effective things that take very littletime. Let me give you like a really hard example that is like asfar away from tech as you could believe. A lot of times people think like, oh, only Silicon Valley SASS tech companies are doing this, youknow, content, social sharing. Okay, how far away is this? Soone of my clients, hundred year old roofing supply company based in Cleveland, Ohio. Okay, is that that far enough? You pretty good?Yeah, that's a pretty polar opposite away...

...from the Silicon Valley, says yeah, okay. So they, you know, they went through some social selling training. One of the one of the sales guys, not me, hethought it that one of the sales guys thought, Hey, wait a minute, I'm up on the roofs every single day and I'm looking at him andI see the problems, like this train is improperly stalled, this flashing iscoming up, this is the Ryan kind of sealant used here. Right.So what did he do. He started taking pictures of it with his iphoneand he posted up and he say this is the improper flashing to have ona you know, on a flat slate roof of Blah, Blah Blah.who take a picture of it and he say what they should do is blah, blah, Blah Blah. So he is an absolute expert and he isliterally out in the field. They call it boots on roof. Right.So he takes this and he just starts. He's just knocking up four, fivea week of these. Well, who is his audience? His audienceis maintenance engineers, facility managers, building owners, and they see, allthey see is this guy identifying problems and how to fix them all the timeand his business just goes. Say It, literally say it through the roof through. So this is just an example. Again, it's not some super fancy, polished, graphic, vetted what it's just authentic. It's in thefield. It's like what's happening. And you know, I mean when weall when everybody started their own business a hundred years ago. That's the wayit worked before everybody came to giant COMP company. So that's just, youknow, one example I see people at trade shows doing things. I seepeople, you know, when they're a user conferences or maybe they're interviewing acustomer. It's just it's not only the authenticity of it, but it's butyou don't get any closer to the customer then being at the customer right.So that's why I'm just I love this final the final frontier of original,created field content and leveraging it through social networks. Yeah, well, so, you know, it's a it's a fantastic concept. I think two thingsspring to mind. I guess number one the the example of the Roofer whois also the salesman. I guess it...

...doesn't always seem to be that clean. It doesn't all. It doesn't always seem to be that the the salesmanis or or the person in sales is also the one strictly implementing trouble shootingit. That overlap isn't always as almost a hundred percent as it is inthis example. So you know, are there ways if you're if you're insales but you're maybe not quite as involved as this as this Roofer in theexample? Is there an ability to create original, feel generated sales content withoutit also coming across as very sales e. yeah, so here's a perfect examplefrom it. Again, completely different industry and I like a unique wasto this this example. Okay, so one of my clients was insurance brokerage, okay, and these guys happened to be in North Carolina right now.If you recall, about four or five years ago, we had to likereally brutal winters in a row on the East Coast and in North Carolina doesnot get single digit temperatures very often. It's like every twenty year kind ofa thing. So there was an article in the paper that said single youknow, obviously you see weather coming three four days ahead, and there's anarticle in the paper that said single digit temperatures coming to the Carolina's. Okay. Well, this guy was a property and casualty insurance ages. So hisjob, his business, was protecting his clients businesses. So he saw thisarticle the newspaper single digit temperatures coming, and what he realized was, hey, people in North Carolina don't really know how to prevent frozen pipes because itdoesn't happen to them. They're often right. So he went on to like howto or aboutcom or something. So He's found an article that said howto prevent frozen water pipes right now, and it's all the things that weknow in the upper midwest like, you know, wrap them mentalels, openthe cupboard of outward wall facing pipes,...

...leave the water dripping at night right. All these things we know. But it was listed there in this articleand then he posted it up on Linkedin so all of his network could seethis, like three days before it started. Now he said he'd never got moreengagement, comments likes for anything he's ever posted on Linkedin. And ifyou, if you analyze that, think about what happened. He he's inthe business of protecting businesses. Now, do you think he wanted his clientsto come back that next day to frozen water pipes and their office was flooded? No, that would probably that would probably not be good protection. Sosimply by sharing, and again, this is not this was not from hiscompany. Let's think of the stacks, right. This was not from stackone. This wasn't from his company, this was not even from stack to. This wasn't about Oh, legislation in North Carolina is changing property and cast. No, this wasn't even an insurance thing. This was like just pure, like common sense. It was very insightful common sense, but it hadnothing to do with his company or his industry. It was just that,oh, it's going to be cold, here's how you protect your business fromfrozen pipes flooding your office and I'm going to share this information with you.Right. So that and not sales. He totally helpful. Yeah, II was just going to say that the certainly the two examples you've provided.I mean they have a very authentic, genuine feel to it and I think, I think a lot of times there is that immediate push back when itcomes to sales. You know, people haven't maybe an image in their mind. They don't want to feel like a high pressure sale situation. So bothof those examples are fantastic of hey, this is this is authentic, thisis genuine information. It's really it's designed to help, because I'm out inthe field, this is what I'm seeing. Certainly not a sales element to it. The they the sort of follow up question that I had thinking aboutthis idea of original field generated sales content. is also that, you know,is there is there a place for overview, review supervision? I mean, like we've touched on the fact that marketing, you know, when theyput out a new piece of content,...

...it's it's certainly it's gone through theproper channels that there has been oversight, there has been you know, ithas been signed off because it's gone through graphic design and copy and editors,you know. So you know you want to put out content quickly, effectivelyauthentically. So you know how much, how much overviewer supervision? Would yousay is is pertinent or relevant or important, especially when you're dealing with a groupthat maybe is just now getting used to this idea of putting out theirown original content? That's a great question. First lets first I want to usethis question to acknowledge we absolutely recognize certain industries are regulated, like financialservices and medical industries, and you can't say anything basically that hadn't been vettedmy marketing. Forget it legal right. So that's one issue. But evenin and outside of that, in a general context, yeah, absolutely.I have clients that have set up process of and a blog is probably abetter example of this than some of the quick like things I just mentioned.So let's say something. What's the blog? So I actually have some clients thathave set up a review process and they say, Hey, look,we realize we'll sales people, you're out. You know you're not necessarily writers andyou know, will prove it for you and let's just make sure it'skind of an in line and things like that. So they'll they've actually setup. Then they're marketing like hey, submit it into here. Will youknow, tighten it up and clean up, make sure your grammared little proofing andwe'll tweak a little bit. Give it back. You can still publishit under under your name. And they're actually rewarding the salespeople. So now, so in this case, sales is not only the greatest content distribution source, they become potentially the greatest content creation source, because this company is actuallynow rewarding sales people who's content gets accepted, vetted, proofed and sent back out. And it's and now it's not just for that one salesperson's network,but they'll pump it back out to any to the entire sales team that maywant to use it and that, you know, makes that Creator. Thatgives them a nice Kudo. They're rewarded for it and their content is sharedon a much larger basis. So that's...

...absolutely a viable process to have inthe loop. Yeah, that's fantastic one, and certainly in it, you know, an atmosphere of competing for attention and eyeballs and ear drums and there'sjust a lot of noise out there. You know, being able to comeup with relevant content and then distribute it is it's such an important part ofthe process and you know, no matter what in stor you're in, ifyou're trying to grow your business, that's that's relevant. So, Kurt,I think this has been some really tremendous content. We really appreciate you takingsome time out of your schedule to join us on the show today. I'msure you could talk more about this, and so if any of our listenersare interested in finding out more, connecting with you or again finding out moreabout van Gresso and the amazing things you and your team are up to,what is the best way for them to go about doing that? Well,for myself, I'll just point you to linkedin. Go ahead and send mea linkedin invitation. Make sure and mention you heard me here on the BobGrowth Show with Jonathan Green, or you can go visit my company website,which is Ben Gresso Dot Com, and I'm sure of that. Will justall be in the show notes that they're looking for. Spelling. Yep,absolutely, Kurt again, thank you so much for your time today. Asa pleasure having you on the show. Great thanks, Jonathan. To ensurethat you never miss an episode of the B Tob Growth Show, subscribe tothe show in Itunes or your favorite podcast player. This guarantees that every episodewill get delivered directly to your device. If you'd like to connect with Btob executives from all over the world, make sure to join our private facebookcommunity. There are some incredible conversations happening inside this group. To Join,Visit Bob Growth Showcom FB. Thank you so much for listening. Until nexttime.

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