B2B Growth: Your Daily B2B Marketing Podcast
B2B Growth: Your Daily B2B Marketing Podcast

Episode 2108 · 11 months ago

3 Steps to Dynamic Digital Content


In this episode, we talk to Jodi Cachey, Vice President of Content Strategy and Growth Marketing at Mediafly.

Yeah hi everyone, welcome back to be to be growth. My name is Olivia Hurley and today I'm joined by jodi, kouachi Vp of content strategy and growth marketing at media fly, jodi, how are you doing? Great, how are you? Thanks so much for having me. I'm doing well. I'm so glad that we get to talk today, we were chatting before about overly communicated about pandemic but we were we had a purpose in talking about that you were saying that if there's anything that's not working in the world of digital marketing it's it's static content. And so you were sharing how over at media fly not being able to go to events was really the impetus for rethinking content digital content in particular and how people interact with it. So I'm wondering if you can take us into the past and share what you were originally doing and then the results that you were seeing from doing that and then we'll launch into what you're doing now. Yeah awesome. So I think that um not being able to go to events at the start of Covid was definitely a part of it. I think that it was just a piece of the puzzle. So there was a lot of other things going on. We obviously, like most sales organizations were going to events, we were not able to, we were at the time meeting with customers live on site at their locations. We were doing digital content and digital marketing, but we weren't doing it to the extent where like everyone was fully digital, we were still relying on, you know, leave behind paper brochure ware and things like that. So I think we were doing all the traditional things that most people were doing pre Covid um when we could have these face to face human interactions and then like everyone else, although we had probably a leg up because we are a digital selling software company, we did have to kind of accommodate this complete and total shift to digital selling. Yeah, absolutely. So when you were talking me through how you originally approached digital content and digital marketing before rethinking the strategy and all of the moving parts. Yeah, so I think previously we were creating digital content um the only way that we knew how and in the way that most people were, we were creating some videos, but for the most part it was a lot of like pdf on screen And I think it was really early on in COVID that we realized like, Hey, this isn't truly digital content and this is probably not going to cut it for this digital world that we're moving into. So I think Gardner just put out a stat that by 2025, of sales interactions are going to be digital and remote. And I know Forrester I've seen some some similar stuff from them. So I think that as we move into this like completely digital selling environment, um it's gonna get harder and harder to capture buyers attention and that static content, those static linear power points that you see sellers throw up in sales meetings or zoom meetings now more specifically and the PDFs that you're sending us follow up are just really not going to cut it if you want to differentiate yourself. Yeah. Yeah, totally. So what are you doing now? Yeah. So it was early on in Covid that I think like I said, we we found that we weren't going to events anymore are sellers weren't meeting with fires in person. So we kind of started to rethink our content strategy and then it was when we looked into our content analytics that we really had this aha moment. So I would say it was probably within like the first couple of months after Covid hit that, we drove into our quarterly content report. We use media fly me to fly sales enablement platform to power both our sales application for our sellers and also our content hub or resources page on our website. So we can see all of these advanced analytics on both, how our sellers are leveraging the content, but also how our buyers are engaging with it. So who are they sharing it with? How long are they spending on a...

...specific asset? How long are they spending on a specific page? Are there certain areas of a piece of content that there were visiting over and over again? So I think it was like the first quarterly content analytics meeting into Covid and we started to recognize some patterns and the patterns were things like really popular long form pieces of content, like guides that we had been relying on for demand gen for so long um were being consumed the same way, so they were getting a lot less few times, people people weren't bouncing, they weren't landing on the asset or downloading it and looking at one page and then leaving like they weren't interested in the content, they were looking at Every page for like 5-10 seconds, so they were skimming the content. Um they were just consuming it differently. Our sellers were not leveraging nearly enough of the content to help them close deals. So I think it was like 47% less than half of our content at the time was being leveraged in sales interactions, which you would think moving into digital, complete digital selling that number would have gone up and we noticed it was going down. So we kind of took a step back and we realized, okay, we need to rethink content creation. We need to determine how we can create content that our sellers want to use and our buyers want to consume. And we kind of did that by looking at three things. So the first thing that we wanted to rethink was the copy or the message and you mentioned this at the beginning, but we knew that people were burnt out on hearing about Covid. Like I think at the beginning everyone is like this is how we feel about Covid and this is what we're doing to address Covid. And and it got to the point where people no longer wanted to hear hope is ruining your life, hope it's ruining your business. Here's how we can help you fix it. It was like, here's how we can help you adapt so that you can move forward and and still have your business grow and succeed and thrive. And so we started changing our messaging a bit. We started being, you know, we we created everything to be challenged based in our messaging. So starting with, you know, this is not our product, but this is your challenge and this is us showing you that we understand your challenge and then we'll introduce our solution. When we get to that point, we shortened the text quite a bit. We inserted more images to make things more swimmable because we knew that that's how people wanted to consume the content. Um, and then we started to look at format, so that's kind of the second angle that we took. And it's, you know, people don't want to just look at boring, static content, like a PowerPoint deck, a pdf on the screen, like that stuff is not going to catch a buyer's attention any more buyers are inundated with content every day and you kind of need to do something more to differentiate yourself and to get your message heard. So we started looking at how can we make the content experience, the content engagement experience that we were creating more interactive. We included animations and things like e books and guides. And, and the longer format e books and guides that we were creating. That we knew people were skimming. We started to kind of condense those down into, you know, more stackable consumable. Um, one pager formats. We uh, next look at consumption. So how are people, how do people want to consume content only? Actually, you asked me an interesting question last week, it was such a simple question. You were like, hey, what marketing books have you read recently that you would recommend? And I had to think really hard about that, which is strange because I used to take a train to work And I would be on the train for like 10 hours a week and I would read like two books a week and I read a ton of books on mostly marketing and how to get my toddlers to behave better. But I could not think of anything for the life of me when you asked me that question and I was like, when is the last time that I read a marketing book? And I think it was because you know, since Covid started, I haven't had the time, I, we had, you know, part time childcare and I was working a lot at night and I started to consume different types of content to kind of, you know, avoid having to read a full book. So, you know, I realized where I'm podcast, you know, Neil Patel has like a 10 minute podcast where he...

...does these, you know, 5 to 10 minute episodes on marketing things. And so if I was in the car by myself, I would listen to a podcast or I would read like a newsletter that I got sent by in Hanley on sunday night and she would have a bunch of articles in there that would be relevant for marketers. So I would read those, so especially considering how quickly things were moving and how much we had to change the way we were going to market. The smaller stackable content worked better for me for the last year as well. So think about that and then think about how you like to consume any content in your consumer life. So you're looking at like Netflix, Spotify, Disney plus. Those are the types of content experiences that we kind of gravitate towards so that we've come to expect. And so we thought a lot about how can we bring those consumer like experiences into our business, you know, sales, marketing content. And one of the ways that we did that was to create this concept of what we call no, no loose ends. So all of our content now or we're moving towards this is that we don't create for follow up or for presentation. All of our content can be presented and then it can be sent as a follow up piece at anima sales meeting and in the, you know, as it sent as a follow up piece, you can drill down into the topics that were presented as deep as you want to go. So everything's linked out to other assets, content recommendations but you can basically consume as much content as you want about a given topic on demand. And so that's one of the biggest things I'd say that we've done but those three things really helped us kind of revamp the way that we're creating content and the way that we're thinking about content and how people consume it. Um and we've seen some really cool results from it so we're really happy with what we've done so far. Hey everybody Logan with sweet fish here if you're a regular listener of GDP Growth, you know that I'm one of the co host of the show but you may not know that. I also head up the sales team here at sweet fish. So for those of you in sales or sales ops I wanted to take a second to share something that's made us insanely more efficient lately. Our team has been using lead I. Q. For the past few months. And what used to take us four hours gathering contact data now takes us only one where 75% more efficient were able to move faster with outbound prospecting and organizing our campaigns is so much easier than before. I'd highly suggest you guys check out lead I. Q. As well. You can check them out at lead I Q dot com. That's L E A D I Q dot com. All right, let's get back to the show him our I love that. I think that way that you explained how you consume content got me thinking about how I consume content. And it was very much like you know and you said this before I choose your own adventure. Which speaks to being able to dive deeper into additional assets. But it's also funny how on the other end I want to be able to be in total control. She's my own adventure. But I also want things served to me on a silver platter. Um and that's exactly what you're doing over Media Fi. That's so cool. Yes, I'm curious if there was a particular point where you and your team pressed on in true digital content where other people usually stop and if there was a sort of like a landmark of, okay, we need to take this further. And if we could identify that. Yeah, I think we started to use some new technologies to try to create this interactive content. And we use like some flip book technologies that are out there, and we started to just kind of put our content into these new formats. And what we realized was that, you know, I would say the first roadblock we met was like you can't put all of this content into these types of formats. So like we were trying to put a guide into like a flip book, but the flip book was so that you could jump around and we were like, well it doesn't make sense if you don't read this guide, start to finish, so let's take a step back. And then we we had a few pieces where we felt we over animated. So we were like, okay, well we need to just make sure that our...

...animation lines up with the story, the sales story that we want to tell. If if it supports the story, if it furthers the story, it's good, we don't want it to distract from the sales story that we're telling. So we're not going to be flat create animations, just be flashy. We're going to create animations to get her point across and to help people consume our message better. So I would say those are two things that we kind of struggled with at the beginning and took us a little bit of time to iron out. But then, interestingly enough, we actually started using a company called Present if I to create some of this animated content, and we ended up acquiring them because we found the services that they were providing to create this interactive content for us were so valuable, we wanted to be able to offer those services to our customers. So we actually now will be in our sales reps, will be in meetings and they'll throw up their animated presentation and they'll be walking buyers through it and you know, they'll be able to kind of veer off into the different topics that the virus want to talk about with all of the content right there. Um, kind of bundled into that document and we'll actually have customers say this is awesome. I've never seen anything presented like this, so it's a differentiator for us, but then they're also like how it's great that you guys can provide the vehicle for me to deliver my content. You can provide the sales application for us to put all of this content at people's fingertips and present it in real time or, you know, send as a follow up. But how do I get this type of content into that application and we now can actually offer them the services to do that. So that's been a really cool thing to see to. It is how well this new format of content resonates with our customers, um and how eager they are to put it in front of their own customers. Oh my gosh, that's awesome. That's also just a brilliant move. I'm so curious if I can take us down a little tangent, kind of backing up to the meetings and conversations where you were idea hating and building out these plans. Can you kind of clue me in is to how you got from hey, something needs to change all the way to all the things we've just talked through in terms of like the internal team. Yeah, for sure. I mean it was, it was, it takes a Village. It was our CMO myself, the content team. We also have a team of creative, like a creative director and designers and, and our sales enablement director played a huge role in it because she obviously is the person with their hand on the pulse of the content analytics and what's resonating with sales. So it was just this kind of monumental effort and let me be clear it's not done yet, we're still working through the content, but I would say we started the first piece of present ified content that we created was a video that we had literally created like in power Point, that's how cool like the animation services are. But we we basically were just trying to pitch, you know, one of our products and the problems that I could solve for people and we created this a script for it and we gave it over to the presented by team, they kind of came up with a story board and we went from there and how the content has evolved from that. Like I think in that first meeting I was like, oh cool, we can create a bunch of videos pretty quickly. Um and then to what it's evolved to now, which is like these interactive one page is where you have a one pager and there's like tabs at the top and you can just dive into, you know, and you have like stats flying in and and just like the stuff that you really want people to remember presented in such a visually striking way. I think there's a stat, like, people remember, I think it's like 20% of what they hear, 30% of what they read, but 80% of what they see and so really like putting those things individuals makes people take so much more away from the conversation, and I think we're seeing that more and more and it's just been so exciting to see, you know, how we came from? Well, yeah, maybe we can create a video, let's storyboard that script to like everything that we're creating now is interactive. And the results that the analytics on these these interactive...

...content pieces are just phenomenal. They're outperforming our static assets far and above a total snowball effect here. Then just like if we can do this, we can do more and we we can do more and more and more. That's so interesting. I love that. And I think that's so typical of how good ideas happen. It's not like somebody comes in with this master blueprint and is like, all right, everybody phalanx around here's the plan. That's so cool. I think it was definitely trial and error. There was a lot of trial and error to try to see. And then, like I said, we can track those advanced analytics. So every time we put out a piece of content we watch it closely and we see how it's performing and we see, you know, we talked to our sellers and we figure out how it's resonating with customers. And and I think when we started our platform can can tie content back to revenue. And when we started are at the height of its covid before we had created all of this interactive content, we had about 1% of content that was actually contributing to revenue. And today we have like over almost, I think it's almost 60% of our content is now contributing to revenue um and helping us to close deals and like I said, we haven't even present ified. We call it all of the assets that we want to. But just this new format is just, it really differentiate us, differentiates us in front of fires and also just hold their attention so much better that they're they're like intrigue and they want, they look forward to the next sales interaction. They're not like, oh, I don't want to talk to a sales person one more time to Right right, Wow, That is first of all, a massive jump and also just big congratulations to you and your team. That's insane. Thank you. I'm curious now when so talking about revenue is one result that you're obviously maybe like the penultimate result here. But what other things are watching? That's an indicator of this is really working even before revenue. I think it's like a lot of it is the time that people are spending interacting with our assets. It's also the amount of people that are involved in B2B buying decisions at this point in time is like huge. Like these buying committees just grow and grow and grow. So I think it's like our ability to speak to higher level stakeholders sooner in the sales process. We've definitely improved that with this new type of content because I think it's. been easier for lower level people within an organization to take it up to their key stakeholders who are actually making the purchase decisions and saying this is what we can do, this is really cool. Let's go ahead and invest in this. Um and I think when they actually can see what's possible, they're more willing to kind of jump into the conversation earlier. So for companies wanting to Take inventory of their digital content and wanting to see results like 1-60% like that massive amount of jump. Can you kind of as you bushwhacked this experience? Can you kind of like trail blaze or trail guide Fresh? I should say what, what a cup the first couple steps are for somebody wanting to get well on their way to seeing those results. Yeah, I think the first step is definitely to complete a content audit. Like you need to take stock of what you have. Um and then I think the next step is a qualitative and quantitative approach to evaluating that content. Um so once you understand what content you have, take a look and see like what content analytics are available to you, I know a lot of people don't have the advanced analytics that we have if you're not using like a sales enablement platform or if you're using something separate for your content hub on your website and sales enablement those stats might be you know the data maybe siloed that sort of thing. But take a look at the data that you do have and try to come up with some hypotheses based on what you see. So, you know, we were able to look really quickly and identify some patterns that we hadn't seen before. Can you identify patterns? Can you see what types of content with formats, you know or your one page is performing better than your guides? That sort of thing I think is going to be really helpful but also talk to your sales...

...team if you're a marketing team and you're trying to determine you know where to allocate resources, what types of of topics and content types to focus on find out from your sellers what's been most helpful for them or what they've, you know, when they've seen in meetings with buyers that kind of aha moment for a buyer click in um and double down on those efforts. But I think you first need to audit then qualitatively quantitatively evaluate what it is you have and what needs to change and then you know, set some benchmarks for yourself so you can track your success and interactivity is obviously key. So I mean don't just create more power point decks, don't just create more pdf one pagers. Like you really need to kind of get your creative juices flowing and kind of come up with new and innovative ways to address today's digital fires because they're bored really hard. I love that. As you were like I said before bushwhacking this foray into the new world of digital marketing. Were there times where you had to backpedal? Were there warning signs that you weren't kind of on target to hit those goals that you had to reevaluate pivot change direction? Yeah, I think so. I mean with any project there's growing pains. So I talked a little bit about how we had kind of dove in and we were trying out new technologies at the beginning and they weren't always, I think it was like I had worked on this document in the specific flip book technology for like, and our designers had learned that there was like a learning curve that and it was like months and months of work and then we got to the end and we were like, we could do this better in a different format. And so we went back to the drawing board and we completely scrapped it and started over and that was so frustrating. But the end result was amazing and we it's just, it turned out so much better, even though we had to kind of start back at square one, it was definitely worth it. I think there were a couple of moments like that, we're like, oh man, why did we do this? We should have done it this way. But I think having the, the ability to kind of take a step back and restart and use a different technology or take a different approach to interactivity was well frustrating worth it. Yeah, definitely. For somebody wanting to try this out, are there warning signs you would just having done it already, you're like, hey, watch for these things? Yeah, I think so. I mean like I said, don't just try to just like animate everything and make everything, you know, I mean you can easily go into a power point presentation and just like animate the crap out of it. But you need to consider a lot like how are you delivering that power point because if there's a million animations in it, you're not gonna be able to send it over email. So things like that, I would say you have to be really mindful of. That's why, you know, we when we create these super animated, super interactive pieces of content, we deliver via our sales enablement platform. So not only can we deliver them, you know, seamlessly, there's no uh this file has to be turned into a link or whatever. You know, they can open it and they don't have any issues with it, but also we can see what they're doing with the content. So the more data you can collect on what you're doing and the more technology you can use to obtain that data, um and kind of analyze it and and, you know, figure out exactly what's working, what's not the better off you'll be. So if there was one thing that you wanted a listener to take away or try out or stop doing, what would it be, um I mean stop thinking of content as the status quo and just something that you send us a follow up or that you have behind your sellers as they're talking, creating a content engagement experience. And looking at your content as an experience rather than just an asset or something that you send after a meeting is gonna go a long way for your strategy because it's especially today where people just have so much noise coming their way and they can't really differentiate different products.

You can really prove how different your product is and make yourself stand out via your content and it's going to have a greater impact than then you think. So. I would say stop just accepting the status quo for content, wow. Well Jody, thank you so much for sharing all of your knowledge, sharing trial and error. And also um just some really good, really good warning signs to where can people go to learn more about you. And media fly, yep. So for media flight can go to www dot media fly dot com or at media fly on twitter or instagram and you can find me on linkedin. Um it's just linkedin beck slash in dex slash jodi. Catchy. Beautiful. Well thank you so much for joining me on GDP growth. Thanks for having me. It was great chatting with you Olivia. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm At sweet fish. We're on a mission to create the most helpful content on the internet for every job function and industry on the planet for the B two B. Marketing industry. This show is how we're executing on that mission. If you know a marketing leader that would be an awesome guest for this podcast. Shoot me a text message. Don't call me because I don't answer unknown numbers, but text me at 4074 and I know 33 to 8. Just shoot me. Their name may be a link to their linkedin profile, and I'd love to check them out to see if we can get them on the show. Thanks a lot. Okay.

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